33 dead....

Many excellent point s here but I definately side with Erich, PzJgr, TA etc.

Did you know that a Housebill was voted on back in January in VA, that was going to be a mandatory thing where every law-abiding citizen in VA would automatically get a Concealed Weapons Permit and would be allowed to have one on them anywhere they went with a few exceptions such as learning and banking institutions. Well, it was defeated by the D~E~M~O~C~R~A~T~S not the Republicans.

A What If?

What if that bill had passed? What if colleg students, faculty etc, had possessed handguns? What if they had them available to them when this creep starterd ITS killing spree? What if even just one, college student confronted that bastard and either diearmed him or shot him dead? At least 31 more people would still be alive of those 33 murdered.

Its also a little bit more tougher these days, to live in Texas.

Case in point:

About two weeks ago, our State Guvnuh - Rick Perry, did the one thing he had ever accomplished during his time in elected office, that I have ever agreed with. He signed a bill making it law, in the State of Texas, that if a criminal was breaking into your car-home, that you (the average citizen, have the legal right to use deadly force against said thug. This does NOT mean that one has the right to just start shooting away--and you KNOW that will not be on one's mind when in said situation.

Here is a case in point that supports the above case in poiint.

Here in the City where I now reside, back in the latter part of last year (Nov or Dec, I can't remember which>) A male decided that he would illegally enter a persons house in order to theft what items he could take. It so happens that one of the LEGAL residents of said home, was at home out of school because he was not feeling well. This person in particular, was a 15 year old boy.

OK, it all started when the school called his mother to take him home--obviously done--and she decided that she needed to get some items from whatevery grocery store nearest to their residence. That store was around 1 mile from their home--which is about half a mile from where I now live. The mother was gone less than half an hour and return3ed only to find, an uninvited guest (aka) an intruder, in her home who was armed with a large butcher knife--who had decided to try to attack her.

The mother managed to get away from the attacker--with cuts and scratches on parts of her body-due to knife-wielding burglar. The woman managed to run upstairs and made it to her sons room (in the meantime, the son heard the struggle from down the stairs and went to his parents bedroom and retrieved a loaded handgun. The son was on his way to help his mother when they met and retreated to his bedroom -- locking the door.

That jerkoff thug, pulled a: Jack Nicholson "Here's Johnny" routine on them by stabbing through the door with said butcher knife and was breaking through said door -- when the "SIN-OF-SINS" happened and, the boy "defending their lives" shot that sum bitch in the head killing him instantly.

That turd would still be alive today, had it not decided to break into someones home for the purpose of stealing. It turns out that, said turd, had a wrapsheep as long as his arm -- meaning - been in and out of prison (like it had a revolving door) for well-over 35 years of his 50 years alive. It was in for rape, robbery, kidnapping, etc.

Well, the end of this story is that Mom and son are alive--thanks to having a (horror-of-horrers) an - an - Evil GUN. The local Police, head of police, and City Attorney etc, hed no problem in the actions taken by this kid and they were released from questioning and the cops had no problems in giving them back their ""evil gun."" On the news that day, the local law-enforcement heads, went on the news to "let-it-be-know" to the local criminals, that they will definately side with the homeowners in their rights to defend their property and family. They also let out a warning to those turds who like to do those "home invasions" (not speaking of burglaries) that the end result of them doing their "home invasions" could end up exactly like what happened to said and VERY dead; burglar.

A few days or a week or so after that had happened, there was onoither case in which a burglar was shot but unfortunately, was not killed. Homeowner was at home when he hear a noise coming from his garage. He grabbed a pistol and went to investigate. Opened garage door, and hear a whoosh--ducking as he heard that sound. The homeowner ducked in time to avoid having an AXE, stuck into his head. The thug had the intent to harm said homeowner--and had no problem in doing so. Well, there was a brief scuffel and homeowner managed to shoot the creep in the leg--creep realized all was lost, and retreated like the cowering cockroach that he is. Said homeowner is (as is that boy from the first story) a local hero.

Back to Rick Perry:

Rick Perry made sure that it was going to be known (by the criminal element) that (in other words) might get themselves killed if they break into a persons home - and that he will support said home owner 100% in their actions. Our District Attorney also went on the news channels and said the same thing. If you know nothing about our D.A. his name is Carlos Valdez and he definately is one tough D.A.

My question is for those who do not believe in guns, or our rights to own those ""evil guns"" is: What would YOU do if that same situation as above happened to you? And you, a responsible gun-owner had "guns?"

A) Tamely submit and probably be murdered along with your wife and children?
B) Grab a weapon and shooting the creep while saving not only YOUR life, but the lives of your family as well?

Now, of those I know on here who own guns--not-a-one-of-them-has-been-in-trouble-or-caused-trouble-because-of-owning-one-or-more-of-those-"evil guns."

I myself, have never been in any trouble nor caused any trouble and I too, am a responsible citizen who is also the owner of multiple guns. In fact, I have been thinking of getting a concealed weapons permit when the time permits me to do so--and yes, I will be carrying around one of those guns with the evil "nazi" markings on it--until I buy a new .45, that I have my eye on.

Otto, forgive me for the use of more forceful language in my post. Its done so in order to make my points stick.

 

^ Case closed.

Good post C. Evans.

Actually, yes!

 

Let's face the truth people, the principles of this country can’t rise above the foundation of this country: capitalism. The firearm companies will never allow any law that might severely hurt their profit be passed. The wealthy businessmen have always had a significant influence over the politics. The people who talk about banning firearms are daydreaming.

What we should make out of this is that in the American society, many Aliens are rejected by the people around them. No one is born a certain way, they are made by the society. This rejection and racism causes them to fell disrespected and inferior. The only solution they can come up with is violence. Just like how the Germans feel disrespected and embarrassed after WWI, and what they did.

Is it his fault? I don’t think so. The decisions he made were influenced by his experiences with society.

I just found this link: http://news.aol.com/virginia-tech-s...ichard-mcbeef-cover-page/20070417134109990001

 

Happened in your neck of the woods,Erich.
Where's the out-cry? "Ban illegals......ban SUV's."
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18160513/

 

Is it the shooter's fault? YES!!! YES! YES! YES! It is not society's. It is not my fault. It is not his parents fault. It is not the fault of his fellow students. It is his and his alone. He made the choice and carried out the act.
It is absolutely absurd......ABSURD! to blame society.
This is how we as a society (the West) get to moral equivocation and a victim mentality. Personal responsibility is thrown out the window. It's society's fault! The battle cry of the intellectually shallow and vapid.

 

In this case it is the shooter's fault. but do we know why? What is the root cause. In the case of columbine, it was those teens' fault as well. but what was the root cause. Would gun control have prevented this foreigner from buying the gun off the street which he did? Gun control will not deter the criminal element from breaking into a home or robbing people in the streets.

As Carl Evans has said, the criminals in Texas now do not have free reign and cannot sue their victims for excessive force ( which started my hatred of lawyers).

Nevertheless, despite our differences, I say we each take few minutes and in our own way think of the victims and their families. I for one will pray for the souls of the deceased and for peace of mind for those who survived.

 

Excellent post Carl. When I was in Texas, I had a permit and carried a 9mm with me in the car. I also have several around the house. I taught my wife how to use it. By God if any intruder just happened to make him self at home in my home, well lets just say I would have whooped some Texas justice on him and I was sent to jail for it, I doubt if I would have received a stiff sentence from the judge. But now, well I agree, good for Perry. Of all the years I carried my gun and had them in my home, there has never been an incident where I had to fire it. I have had to pull out twice to scare off some teen gangs running through my sister's yard. Those in other countries can never understand but having those guns is just as important in this age as it was in the 1700s and 1800s. Only difference, we are defending ourselves from the 2 legged animals.

I've spoken my mind. Happy posting fellow Gents and be glad that we live in countries where we can speak our mind freely.

 

Come to think of it, I do fall under the LEORSA (Law Enforcement Officer's Restoration Safety Act) laws. Yes, I teach construction trades in a federal prison but, I technically am a federal officer too (I have to "guard" the class myself). This means if I just happened to go to VT I could have been toting and the Kampus Kops and administration couldn't have done squat about it.
That law essentially means as long as I have my federal credential on me I can concealed carry anywhere in the US legally (except where federal law prohibits it like on aircraft).

 

Liviu Librescu: Holocaust survivor blocked shooter, letting students flee

http://www.roanoke.com/vtvictims/wb/113497

The e-mails from grateful students arrived soon after Liviu Librescu was shot to death, telling how the Holocaust survivor barricaded the doorway of his Virginia Tech classroom and saved their lives at the cost of his own.

Librescu, an Israeli engineering and math lecturer who survived the Nazi killings and later escaped from Communist Romania, was one of several foreign victims of Monday's shootings, which coincided with Israel's Holocaust remembrance day.

"My father blocked the doorway with his body and asked the students to flee," Librescu's son, Joe Librescu, said Tuesday in a telephone interview from his home outside Tel Aviv. "Students started opening windows and jumping out."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070417/ap_on_re_mi_ea/virginia_tech_world_victims

 

After having read about the letter the killer left I´m quite sure the person had a very bad personal disorder probably closing in on a psychotic view.


" Now it´s all your fault..."

As if the killer is not doing anything himself, all is because the girl was leaving him/not starting to date him/ was unfaithful. Which is pretty nuts. The guy does not even take the blame of anything, he´s totally clean himself. I recall Hitler saying the same thing in his bunker 1945.


After killing the two persons there was a delay of time, after which the massacre begun. This means he had time to think what he was going to do. I guess that is called " murder" then. The usual guy would have given himself in for doing " the bad thing" in total rage. And even total rage is not good enough reason for me for someone to handle the situation like this. There is a bigger problem under the surface.

ANyone who takes up a knife or a gun during a quarrel should be examined more carefully.

Just my views after having read about this....

 

Since when? Not particularly interested in the gun control debate but would like to know in what time period the number of incidents has gone up by 400% and what the source is.

 

I'm not going to get involved in the gun control argument - none of us will ever agree. Although I personally feel that the UK handgun ban was an over-reaction, one has to admit that since then we have thankfully not had a repeat of the Hungerford/Dunblane tragedies - yet.

But this crime in Virginia is so appalling - what a coward. As far as I'm concerned, if you want to commit suicide - go right ahead. But to execute so many fine young people ; disgusting.

I feel very sorry for the many families bereaved in this way.

 

Thank you Miller, PzJgr.

And to those who still after reading my long-winded posting, if you still feel that we should not own guns here in the USA, take my next two little stories in account.

If it were not for possessing a gun (in this case, it was a 9 shot .22 cal handgun)

In about March 1988, I had a parttime job delivering the San Antonio Light Newspaper. One had to be at the paper drop off point by 3:30 am. The place had no lighting within 100 or more yards so one could not see very far. The place was also about 75 yards set back from the nearest street, surrounded by thick brush and dozens of large Mesquite trees, barbedwire fence and lots of junk from a nearby business.

That said, once I got my bundles of newspaper, I loaded them into my car and drove to Faske's Gas Station a few blocks away as it at least had one lightbulb opn at night and was enough for me to see to put the various sections of paper together, and load them into the car.

I was in the midst of doing this when I heard a sound that sounded like rain coming towards me. I was irritated that if it were starting to rain, that I would have to take the time to place all papers in plastic sleeves so they would not get wet.

I had been carrying a .22 cal pistol under the seat of my car for weeks now because I very frequently went to the County Rifle Range and would fire off 200 - around 500 shots. Anyway, this pistol I had kept in a medium sized small brown paperbag, and for some reason, I don't know why, and fo rthe first time since I started carrying the pistol. I took it from the hiding place and still in bag, laid it on top of my cars hood.

The "rain" was coming closer and I looked to my right just in time to see a group of about 100 illegal aliens run past my car from 6th street taking a right going down the 200 block of Doddridge Street (the first street I had lived on)

Anyway, about a minute or so later, another "rain shower" was approaching and it too passed me by. In that group, there were not as many as the first group but not much less than. They ran passed me and like the first group, nobody said a word or did anything.

I was about finished with building my 250 papers, when out of the darkness, two illegals approached me and my car. Neither spoke any English and I did not speak any Spanish at that time. I only understood them asking which direction it was to San Antonio. While one guy tried to keep my attention on him, the 2nd tried to slip around my back - but I cought his movement and turned grabbing my pistol.

I too my pistol (knowing it was not loaded, but the area was dark enough that the illegals would not know) and I aimed it at the 2nd guy wll the while the first one then tried to move in on me. I was 18 years old at that time, and almost shit a brick. The only thing I knew to do was to point my gun at that guys face. After being cussed out in Spanish (yes I know what the words were as it always seems that one learns the cuss words from any language first before learing what one should) Needless to say, having a pistol at that moment in time--empty or no, I felt, saved my life.

2nd story:

I was still living in Kingsville, and this was around 1992 and took place on Halloween. I was working of a few traffic tickets that I had got in Corpus Christi, by doing comminuty service (volunteering) at non-profit places in CC. I on Halloween, volunteered to run a games booth for some Church in Corpus. This Church was in a predominately black part of town known as The Cuts. That is a part of town that the Cops don't like driving through especially at night.

I came to town several hours before I was to head over to the Church to volunteer at. One of my stops was at Heavy's Gun Shop - to pick up a purchase that I had made a few months earlier -- my gun was finally in. This was my first Walther P-38 I had ever bought and I thought it was the collest of guns to have--all matching and still in pretty nice condition for being one of those "battlefield pickups" from the Stalingrad battlefield area--during and after that battle. Anyway, my Walther was in and I went to pick it up. I placed it in a .30 cal ammo can, and put it in the trunk. Later on I got a papaerbag for it so the finish would not get messed up from rubbing against metal. I placed this gun under my car seat before I went into the Church to do my volunteering.

Well, I did my volunteering at said Church, having fun doing so, The event was over about 9:30 PM, and outside was dark as heck. My car at that time, was a good car but always needing a bit of work. I had been having a problem with my brake fluid leaking and by the time I made it almost out of the cuts, I had no brakes and stopped in a dark parkinglot (not by choice) and was in a very dark area on the outskirts of The Cuts.

I got out of my car - not being able to see my hand in front of my face - spent several minutes feeling around in the dark for the brakefluid well. At that timw, two men came out of the dark and asked if I had $2.00 I could spare so they could get ciggarettes. Not even realizing that I had grabbed my gun and placed it on the airfilter cover - minutes before those guys came up to me.

Same as with those two illegals from about 5 years earlier) one guy tried to keep my attention while the other tried to slip behind me but, I grabbed my pistoil just in time to stop 1st guy in his tracks-who then said: "Oh Shit, he's got a gun!" and I said: "Yeah, and I KNOW how to use it."

Both those guys ran in the direction they had just came from. I was shaking in my shoes, barely managed to put some brake fluid in and not fastening the cover-throwing it into my cars seat--I took off like a bat out of hell. I drove about 4 miles-without breack until I reached a Circle K store and was able to fill the well and "get the hell outta Dodge."

Little did those two guys know, my gun had no ammo. That was the 2nd time that one of those "evil guns," withour ammo; saved my life.

No, those here who are against people owning guns, and are for strict gun control; really should look at it from my point of view so you can further understand why we feel that we need to own guns. Just wait till you are in a similar situation sometime and you will come around to our way of thinking.

Sorry this was so long, it was not intended to be.

 

"You had a hundred billion chances and ways to have avoided today," the 23-year-old says in a harsh monotone. "But you decided to spill my blood. You forced me into a corner and gave me only one option. The decision was yours. Now you have blood on your hands that will never wash off."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070419...hooting_266;_ylt=AoMETe6t8VOgquP_kOTiC79H2ocA

"Your Mercedes wasn't enough, you brats," says Cho, "Your golden necklaces weren't enough, you snobs. Your trust funds wasn't enough. Your vodka and cognac wasn't enough. All your debaucheries weren't enough. Those weren't enough to fulfill your hedonistic needs. You had everything."

"You have vandalized my heart, raped my soul and torched my conscience," he says, apparently reading from his manifesto. "You thought it was one pathetic boy's life you were extinguishing. Thanks to you, I die like Jesus Christ, to inspire generations of the weak and the defenseless people."

 

Scary thought that lunatics roam around free and armed. The worst is that such reactions can not be prevented. He even went to post office and mailed his recording between the two massacres. In his mind he consided himself as a martyr or an example.... Let's hope nobody gets inspired by that psycho.

 

He was himself inspired by the guys at Columbine....I think he mentioned the guys in his recordings.

 

In the case of that-boy, the PC definition, the wheel's still turnin, but the Hampster's dead !

It is too bad we couldn't (offend him)(by strapping him to a table with a Thorizine drip since 05 when he stalked those 2 girls), until he did something violent.

Criminally insane ! Scumbag Terrorist ! Total Nut-Job !

I suggest we not use his name again. He does not deserve to live (even in memory) beyond the time he did, if even that long. I believe it was his plan to be eternal...let's deny that, for the sake of those who died.

 

That will be easy for me, I haven't even memorized his name. I agree that using the word terrorist in his case is correct. He even dressed like a so called kamikaze, like it was a game.

 

Saw the video clip which he had sent of himself to MSNBC right after he had killed two at the dorm and was on his way to campus...... A really disturbed individual.... His parents upon hearing the news of their son, tried to commit suicide and were taken to the hospital.