Blacks in WWII

Here is something that you guys can help me out with.

To what capacity did blacks contribute to the War effort? I know they made huge sacrifies and contributions on the aviation front, but did any black units fight the Wermacht on the land? Infantry, Armored, field artillary, etc?

I did read the afforementioned Red Ball Express and found it to be quite interesting.

 

I am going to spell this wrong but someone will surely mention more. But the all Black Tuskagee airmen flew the P-51 in 44-45 on the 15th Air force front. The unit was the 332nd fighter group with the Red Tails. One of the more unique features is that the air group was quite excellent in protecting 'their' bomber groups on offence/defence. Unfortunatly only rarely was the Black outift called to tackle Luftwaffe a/c in combat. But when they did they proved their worth.

good researching !

~E

 

I read a feature on those guys kin FSm some time ago. One point i noted was that those of the unit that were shot down and captured say that they were treated better by the Germans than they were by their own country men.

 

yes you are correct Bish. There were several 'Black' units that comprised several engineer units and the crap task of clean-up......

~E

 

Supraspinatus, you may find the following sites helpful:

US Army Corps of Engineers: A Historic Context for the African-American Military Experience

Department of Defense, African American History Month, Medal of Honor, World War II

[ 05. January 2004, 01:59 AM: Message edited by: Crapgame ]

 

BTW, Vernon J. Baker is the only living black MoH Recipeint from WW2. I think I have his address as well.

Just checked and yup, I have his address.

Vernon J. Baker, 1st Lt US Army WW2 MoH Recipient. He was born on: December 17/1919. He served with: the 370th Regiment in the 92nd Infantry Division. He currently lives in Idaho.

 

And I think that many other colour soldiers must be mentioned, besides the USA Army - which, I think had one or two infantry divisions of African-Americans - but the colour troops who served in the British Army and many of the Colonial French troops as well.

 

And of course lets not forget the Indian troops who served with the German Army.

 

But are Indians considered as black?

 

No, but should they be ignored. And as the French colonial troops were mainly Arabs, they ain't really blacks either. Maybe we should be thinking more along the lines of non-whites in WW2.

 

Just as a parallel, however unfortunate it was before and during the Second World War, the U.S. military regarded blacks much in the same way as the Nazis did the Polls.

[ 05. January 2004, 04:02 PM: Message edited by: Geistforscher ]

 

seems a bit ironic really don't it. seems you can segreagte and de-humanize blacks and coloureds, but not whites. maybe thats why it was ok for the british and French to have there Empires, but not for Germany

 

No, Bish. I actually meant French Senegalese and Centroafrican colonial troops who were black, not the Moroccian divisions formed by Arabs.

 

fair one, but why just select Blacks. isn't that racist

 

It's not racism, it's not hi-jacking the thread!

 

The_Historian has asked for the Freemasons in WW2 earlier, supraspinatus now for the Blacks. Nothing wrong to select interest and request info.

I also could ask for Trekkies serving in WW2, even though the question would not make too much sense.

 

Freddy, ‘Blacks’ in Britain has a very different meaning to ‘Blacks’ in the US. In Britain ‘Blacks’ typically means West Indians, who only class other non-whites as ‘Blacks’ when it suites their purposes.

Why would W.W.II references be one such occasion? Well let’s consider the whole of the Caribbean and say New Zealand. In 1943 Jamaica alone had a population of 1,237,063 (official census), @ 97% Black which is @ 1,199,951.

Apart from working on local bases etc, they say; ”A composite force known as the Caribbean Regiment was raised from these units [various islands] and served overseas in many theatres of war under the control of the British Army Council.”

Hmm….impressive until you look for Battle Honours and casualty figures. Why? Well; ”The Caribbean Regiment was formed in April 1944 with about 1,200 men, most of who were volunteers from the local defence forces. The regiment was trained in Virginia, USA. The Caribbean Regiment was transferred to Italy in June 1944 and later guarded prisoners of war in Egypt but did not see any action. The Caribbean Regiment was disbanded in 1946.”

Now, let’s consider the New Zealand Maoris, total population then @ 98’750. They formed the 28th Maori Battalion (1939-1946)

Service - N.Africa, Greece, Crete, Italy

KIA or died of wounds – 627
Non fatal wounded – 1725
POW - 236

BEM – 1
DCM – 13
DSO – 7
MBE – 1
MC – 21 (3 bars)
MM – 51
US Silver Star – 1
Victoria Cross - 1

London Gazette, 1st June, 1943: During the attack at Tebaga Gap on 26th March 1943, Second Lieutenant Ngarimu commanded a platoon. He was first to reach the crest of the hill and himself destroyed two enemy machine-gun posts. The enemy counter-attacked, and in the course of hand-to-hand fighting, Lieutenant Ngarimu was twice wounded, but refused to leave his post. During the night the enemy succeeded in piercing the line; Lieutenant Ngarimu ran to the spot, killed some and drove back the rest with his tommy-gun and with stones, and led his men back to their old position. In the morning, he was killed while defying a further counter-attack.



No.9

 

There was also a gunner who flew with Bomber Command. I think he was West Indian.
I believe he was Killed in Action.
Maybe Martin could throw a bit more light on this ?

 

There was also a gunner who flew with Bomber Command. I think he was West Indian.
I believe he was Killed in Action.
Maybe Martin could throw a bit more light on this ?

 

Sgt. L O Lynch from Jamaica served as an air gunner with the RAF from 1942. During his training in Canada he was awarded the air gunner's trophy for two years running, in 1943 and 1944, for obtaining the highest percentage of marks in his course. On his first operational mission over enemy territory he shout down a JU88.

source Lest We Forget - The Experiences of World War II Westindian Ex-Service Personnel by Robert Murray

Also mentioned; Flight Officer Jullian Marryshow from Grenada. He joined 193 Sqn and was flying Typhoons in 1944.

And a few others...

[ 06. January 2004, 12:32 PM: Message edited by: Stevin Oudshoorn ]