Great site. Father in Law is eligible for a medal from France..Legion of Honor.. Criteria are ..Living,....proof that he fought in France. Discharge says Ardennes,Central Europe and Rhineland.I spoke to charge of Affairs French consulate in NYC and she said it needs to be very specific. Ardennes fought in Belgium hard to differentiate.He fought in Alsace Lorraine which sounds like The Battle of the Colmar Pocket. 75th Divison 191st infantry. He also recieved a "Diploma" from the goverment of France. Attached. He is 93 and our hero..any help appreciatted.
If he served with the 75th Infantry Division, then you must have meant 291st Infantry. I'm not sure what they mean by "very specific", but I presume that means it is not enough to show he served with a unit that fought in France**. Perhaps Morning Reports showing he and his Company were in France and fought there. Edit: ** What I mean by this is that a soldier could have been with a unit in France but not while they were in combat, or could have been in combat with a unit but not while it was in France.
Hello, The Legion D'Honneur is the highest award and is awarded for outstanding conduct. Only a tiny portion of Veterans received it . I once knew a veteran who applied four times and never got it, despite having fought the war from A to Z , the Battle of France, 3 escapes from three German pow camps , including Rawa Ruska which was for dare devils . He made it all the way back from Ukraine, crossed the entire Reich, went to France joined the Resistance, took part in many combats until the liberation, join the Free French then took part in the occupation of Germany and Austria. Eveything was proven and yet not sufficient. so good luck . Btw an introduction and saying hello wouldn't hurt and would attract more attention.
The French decided in, I think, 2014 and corresponding to the 70th anniversary of the Normandy D-Day to award the Chevalier rank of the Legion d'Honneur to all surviving veterans who fought in the battles to liberate France in 1944. This is an amazing gesture by the French but, at the same time, seems a little tough on those veterans who died in the battles or, like my own father, have died since the War: it can not, in other words, be awarded posthumously. The Legion d'Honneur had previously been awarded only to those veterans who had done 'something special' for France: typical examples would be those veterans who had been involved in commemorations over very many years in France etc etc. I have guided a number of UK veterans in their application for the Legion d'Honneur including a veteran who was awarded his medal only a week ago. I'm not sure how the application process works in the USA but, in the U.K., it is via our Ministry of Defence who check, from the veterans Service Record, that they did take part in the appropriate battles. The criteria are actually, on the face of it, straightforward: 1. The veteran must be alive on the date the medal is applied for 2. The veteran must have taken part in the battles to liberate France in 1944. 3. This includes ALL those who took part and not just Army personnel. This means that the veteran could have been Navy or Air Force as well...provided their Operations were directly linked to the Liberation of France. Bottom line: the 'bar' is not set that high (in relative terms) but definitive proof must be provided to the French. I suggest you identify another veteran who has successfully applied for the medal and take it from there. As I've stated earlier, I'm not a USA resident but don't you have a Department for Veteran Affairs?.......or something similar.
This is interesting regarding this award- http://www.homestead.afrc.af.mil/News/ArticleDisplay/tabid/8783/Article/701185/world-war-ii-veterans-receive-french-award.aspx I know the French awarded veterans, who aided in the liberation of France in WWII an award-- like on the 50th and 60th anniversary, But never their highest award. Usually they needed to travel to France and attend the ceremony-difficult for most veterans in their later years.
Thanks for this, SDP. On the 50th it was a French Jubilee of Liberty medal. On the 60th it was a Brest badge. This is special but seems more fitting to be awarded to those who gave their lives.
I agree with your final comment..but that's not for us to decide. Let's not decry the fact - this is an amazing gesture by the French. I've attended presentation of medal, seen and heard about others and on all occasions the veterans have said words to the effect of "this is accepted on behalf of not just me but for all of my old friends and Comrades".
View attachment 25252 I think the discharge would have to say Normandy or Northern France to meet the criteria.
Provided he was directly involved in the Campaign to liberate France, my understanding is that he will qualify for the award.
Just saying that this maybe the reason for the "very specific" comment. No mention of France, and the discharge is not enough, alone, to meet the criteria.
It appears unfortunate that cheech56 has not checked back since posting the original question about a week ago.....this makes it very difficult, if not impossible, to judge whether our input is helpful or a waste of time....... :-(
I'm afraid you're right, but anyway, one last detail before I leave. From what Iknow,, one must not apply oneself for the medal, but be recommended.
It's only been a few days since the topic was started. The OP may have other obligations that needed more immediate attention.
Thank You all..especially SDP(for reminding me to update). Yes this all started when a local newspaper published an account of a WW2 vet receiving the Legion of Honor. I have been emailing the French Consulate in NYC and they have been very responsive and timely with any questions that I may have. I asked if the diploma was enough proof and she quoted [SIZE=11pt]Actually when this diploma was awarded all the [/SIZE][SIZE=14.6667px]verification's[/SIZE][SIZE=11pt] regarding the participation in battles in France have not always been made.[/SIZE] [SIZE=11pt]Meaning that the Grand Chancellery needs extra documents proving the battles in France. For example a list of his missions. [/SIZE] The application is lengthy and my Father in Law(93 yrs old) is starting to fill it out. He arrived from New York on January 15 1945 and was assigned to the 75th Division 291st Infantry Company K. His first stop was the Battle of the Bulge for less than a month with no action just frozen feet.Then they got orders to go south to fight off Himmler's last stand in France better known as the Colmar Pocket. He was involved in raids at night across the Rhine( strong currents) to capture an enemy solider to bring back Intel. He described how they entered a house and found a bunch of German citizens having a party and them barging in and questioning them and going back to camp empty handed. Then he headed back north and fought in the battle at Ruhr. On the way he was lead scout and somehow the group of 3 scouts got way ahead of there company. Well they got trapped in a town plaza under heavy fire and impossible odds. He prayed and got ready to meet the King of Kings..God! Well God had other plans..after being pinned by a monument under heavy fire they timed there run and ran...unfortunately a fellow soldier was shot right next to him and passed and he escaped down a sloping field that gave him protection from the fire. Well this standoff and his bravery resulted in him receiving the Bronze Star Medal. While doing research we may have found a picture of him from boot camp(it looks like him,company K etc). This pursuit is very rewarding for the both of us and has me thinking that I should document or film an interview with my Father in Law to preserve a commentary on a great American Hero. Thanks for the responses ..
Cheech56 Thanks for the update. Appreciated. While it's obviously up to the French and obviously absolutely nothing determinable by us, I suggest you don't raise his expectations too high: consider it more of a hope than an expectation about the medal. Let me explain: I think the date of his arrival in the theatre of operations explains why, in an earlier post, it was mentioned that the bar is set very high. 1. The main battle for France had concluded several months earlier....basically in September 1944 2. The so-called Battle of the Bulge had also finished earlier in the January and, in any case, and apart from final mopping up Operations, was fought in Belgium so nothing to do with liberating France. This implies that he is not entitled to the medal under the general terms of the 2014 award to all living veterans involved in the Liberation of France (which is normally considered to be Normandy - Operation Overlord etc -, Operation Dragoon and actions in Northern France). This itself implies that he could still be covered but only under the much harder to prove special services to France category and hence the high bar requirements. Whilst not meaning to demean his actions in any way - he was clearly in the thick of the action at various stages - it can only be decided by the French if the Colmar Pocket actions count. Actions after the Colmar Pocket in, for example, Germany also don't count for obvious reasons. I wish you well with your efforts in securing the award of the Legion d'Honneur for him. Please keep us updated as this may also help others in similar circumstances. Steve (SDP).
