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in the straits of Denmark

Discussion in 'Atlantic Naval Conflict' started by Erich, Jan 21, 2007.

  1. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    for Martin whose private box is full :D and any other RAF researchers who have info on the mining ops in the area of Denmark during 1945.

    Gentlemen anyone have a good reference(s) covering these missions ? ordnance carried, type of a/c flown, squadrons/groups that took part ?

    there be a book coming out in the future on these but until then would like a little info for the data files if possible.

    Luftwaffe Nachtjagd resistance was primarily from I./NJG 3 flying the Ju 88G-6 under Major Werner Husemann [​IMG] winner

    thank you Erich ~
     
  2. Ali Morshead

    Ali Morshead Member

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    Erich,

    Are you expecting the mining to be a formal operation.

    My various readings show that the mining was often done by crews on their early missions.
     
  3. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    Ali there was quite a step up in mining ops by the RAF during 44-45 and the I./NJG 3 was moved into position to take on those particular mine droppers being fairly successful.

    E ~
     
  4. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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    Erich I know this is not what you are looking for but it has some really good pictures of German mines and a Halifax dropping a depth charge on a U-boat and many other pictures that I have not seem before. It looks like the pictures were taken early in the war. The engine room of a British sub is interesting as the sailors don't have ear protection and are between two large diesels. :eek:

    I will look in my Halifax and Sterling books thursday and see what squadrons and what aircraft were lost if that helps.

    http://www.cyber-heritage.co.uk/cutaway/
     
  5. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    anything helps gents, keep it comin :D
     
  6. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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    I have alot of information so I will give it to you in installments.

    First mineing operations were called "gardening" by the crews and the map locatons were given names like Daffodil, Yew Tree, Undergrowth, Verbena, Broccoli, Asparagus, ect. ect.

    For Sterlings, four mines were carried, then 6 then 7 after bomb door mods. 7x 1,500lbs Type A Mark V mines were laid at 200 feet off the surface. German flak ships were stationed around likely sites and took a heavy toll. 341 mines were laid by 115 Sterlings and 45 were lost for a loss rate of 39.13%

    Some specific aircraft: W7579 was lost in Daffodil area August 14, 1942. Crashed at sea off Nymindegab Denmark.

    W7531 was lost May 17, 1942 in the Baltic.

    Verbena area was off Copenhagen.

    During October 1942, 218 squadron laid 119 mines in 35 sorties.

    During March thru the end of Oct. 3 Group in Wellingtons flew 748 mining sorties, where as Sterlings flew 543 sorties in the same period. In total the RAF laid 2977 mines in 44 areas.

    From the book The Sterling Bomber by Michael J.F. Bowyer
     
  7. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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    Part 2

    Statistics for 1945, these are cumulative totals and not just for the Denmark area.

    Jan 17,834 aircraft dispatched, 391 lost, 43,393 mines sowed.

    Feb 18,126 aircraft dispatched, 400 lost, 44,747 mines sowed.

    March 18,402 aircraft dispatched, 405 lost, 45,945 mines sowed.

    April 18,682 aircraft dispatched, 408 lost, 47,307 mines sowed.

    May 19,025 aircraft dispatched. I believe the book made an error because the lost ac and mines sowed are the same for April.

    From Bomber Command 1939-1945 by Richard Overy.

    More on Sterling losses: On April 28/29,1943, 227 aircraft from 75,90,214, and 219 squadrons were dispatched to the Baltic area and 23 aircraft were lost.

    Early in the war there was infighting between the Coastal Command and Bomber Command over aircraft allocation. The best places to drop mines was the Baltic and Scandinavian waters but Coastal Command did not have long range aircraft to do this and Bomber Command wanted to keep their aircraft to bomb Germany. Post war analysis showed the RAF could have done more with mining than bombing Germany.
    From Air Power at Sea by John Winton

    More to come, but I have to do my tax return. :mad:
     
  8. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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    Last part:

    The above stats are cumulative totals from Feb. 23, 1942-May 1945

    For only 1945 the figures would be:

    Jan. 159 dipatched 6 lost 668 mines sowed

    Feb. 292 dispatched 9 lost 1354 sowed

    March 276 dispatched 5 lost 1198 sowed

    April 280 dispatched 3 lost 1362 sowed

    May 343 dispatched 0 lost 0 sowed

    I don't understand the May amounts but that is what the book has. :confused:

    This is just for Bomber Command and does not include mines sowed by the Royal Navy or Coastal Command.

    The loss rate for the whole war for mining was around 21%.

    Arthur Harris did not like mining operations and resisted as much as he could.

    The mines used early in the war were magnetic and were dropped at low speed and low altitude with a parachute attached. The chutes were released by a sea water soluble plug and floated away while the mine sank to the sea bed.
    The mines had to be in shallow water in order to be activated, so navigation was a problem at night.
    The sea lanes near the Friesian Islands and the entrance to the Kiel Canal were favorite spots to lay mines but the Germans kept alot of flak boats in the area, as well as on the coast to shoot the planes down.

    The alitude the mines were laid was between 400-1000 feet. There was little chance of getting out of the aircraft if hit that low and the sea was very cold, so survival was very low.

    Early in the war Hampdens of No. 5 group got most of the mining operations.

    I hope some of this is of use to you Erich.
     
  9. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    excellent TA, now to copy this for my files. got to find a pic or two to post up ....
     
  10. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    the nemisis of RAF mining units in late 44-45 . I./NJG 3 crews and one of their Ju 88G-6's
     
  11. TA152

    TA152 Ace

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    Stevin likes this.
  12. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    thanks will keep that for reference.

    here is the pic I was trying to post .. ..........

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Stevin

    Stevin Ace

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    Hi Erich,

    This probably doesn't help as the book is not available to the public at large, but 489 Sqn just had its history published. It was heavily involved in mining and anti-shipping mission;

    www.basher82.nl/489sqnhistory.htm

    you also could try soren Flensted;s site, but I assume you already tried that;
    http://www.flensted.eu.com/
     

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