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Gallantry Over North Africa - Hans Joachim Marseille...The Star of Africa

Discussion in 'Air War in the Mediterrean' started by Flag Des Div 98, Apr 17, 2009.

  1. Flag Des Div 98

    Flag Des Div 98 Member

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    [​IMG]

    The Star of Africa

    The Battle of Britian at times captures the imagination concerning swirling overhead dogfights,the dance of death of,"Experten" ...the German term for the best.
    Yet the Battle of Britian was zenithed by another theatre...whose death matches lasted over 3 years.....as the war shifted from places like Malta in the Med..to North Africa....then to Italy and Sicily.

    The opponents slugged it out with limited resources...maintenence crews of both sides being the controllers of the days events....ie..how many "Kites" are available today.
    These death matches above were fought by men suffering severe privations....many were often sick with diseases and disentary....they continued on as their freinds names where crossed off the flight lists for the final time.

    Like a tug of war...the "Advantage" turned for short periods as new aircraft entered service..or familiar ones with "Max power" engines appeared.
    The Spitfire V ...the Me-109G...the FW-190.


    Gallantry Over North Africa

    Luftwaffe Experten Hans Joachim Marseille.."The Star of Africa" found himself in this theatre via the "This guy is not a team player" certificate.
    After conflict in France with leadership....Hans's skills found him transferred...here at least...Hans could be a "Hunter"..and have more controll over his daily life....a German fighter pilots dream.

    Hans was a killer,[158 recorded]...History,however marks him for an exceptional act of Gallantry ...this killer had a soul.

    On Sept 14th 1941.....Hans downed a Hawker Hurricane flown by LT Pat Byers.


    Byers was badly burned escaping the wreckage.......brought back to a Luftwaffe airfield.
    2 Days later Byers home airfield came alive with anti-aircraft fire as 2 ME 109's aprroached......a small package dropped with a note.
    "We are sorry to report that LT.Byers was shot down Sept 14 by aircraft of this squadron.He was badly burned while escaping the cockpit.He is now in Derna Hospital to recover.We wish to express the regrets of the Luftwaffe".

    2 weeks later at dawn Marseille returned ,braving the groundfire to deliver a second note which told of LT Byers passing away from wounds...again a comment of regret.

    Several at the British/Australian airfield were impressed by this act of Gallantry,yet to them....the messenger was unknown until after the war.

    Hans Marseille would not live to fellowship in later years as some do today...on Sept 30th 1942,a year after his gallant act,
    Hans lost his life bailing out from his ME 109.
    His popularity in Germany rivaled Field Marshall Rommel,


    Letters arrived ,some from the allies.........to the Star of Africa.

    [​IMG]

    [a detailed account can be found in
    World War II magazine Jan 1999 ed]
    Eyewitness Account
    Gallantry Over North Africa

    Hans-Joachim Marseille - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
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  2. Bolshevik

    Bolshevik Active Member

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    Can this individual lay claim to being the best fighter pilot of all time?

    He was an expert at deflection shooting, could bring down aircraft with only a few rounds, and could also fire his guns effectively with the aircraft upside down or in steep bank, or in any situation where he could get a bead on his target.

    He falls into the category of pilots that were killed unvanquished, and he certainly is a candidate for the Greatest of All Time, in any country, in any war.

    What does the Forum think of that?

    I'd be interested to know

    Bolshevik
     
  3. Bolshevik

    Bolshevik Active Member

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    Marseille is also credited with multiple kills in the same mission, including a fight over Bir Hachiem which knocked down seven South African fighter aircraft and paved the way for an important Stuka attack.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but some of the Eastern front aces did not achieve this, and the only compatible incident I can think of is Major William Barker during the Great War, which I believe he got a VC for. Marseille got his Knights Cross I think didn't he?
     
  4. harolds

    harolds Member

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    Marseille is probably on the short list of all-time best fighter pilots. There is some controversy re. just how many planes he did down since his claims and British records don't always jibe. Some of this may be due to the fact that if a Brit plane was hit, then crash-landed and the plane was considered recoverable, the RAF considered it only damaged. Since Marseille had a habit of using an insanely small amount of ammo per kill, I suspect many of his victories either got back to an emergency field or dead-sticked it behind British lines.

    Knights Cross? Yes, with Oak Leaves, Swords and Diamonds! The last being awarded after his death.
     
  5. Carronade

    Carronade Ace

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    The Luftwaffe War Diaries by C.D. Bekker credits Marseille with seventeen kills in one day, three missions, including eight P-40s in one flight. Particularly noteworthy since the P-40 had a reputation as a rugged aircraft and Marseille was flying an Me109F, armed only with one 15 or 20mm cannon and two 7.92mm machine guns. Good shooting indeed.
     
  6. Bolshevik

    Bolshevik Active Member

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    It certainly is an example of exceptionalism in every category.

    Such a pity this man did not survive the war. He would have probably been more famous than Adolf Galland or Johannes Steinhof. He might just have been one of the pilots that could have been strapped into an Me262. No doubt his expertise would have served him well in a jet fighter.
     
  7. harolds

    harolds Member

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    The only criticism I have is that he, and a couple of other pilots, getting 90+% of his unit's (JG 27) kills. This meant that he did most of the fighting for his squadron (Staffel). What were the others doing? I don't know but some accounts suggest that the rest of his unit were not productive. This isn't a criticism of just him but also of JG 27's leader, Eduard Neumann.
     
  8. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    I read that the Allied protective method was to fly all the planes in one big circle whenever the axis attacked. The meant planes would thus protect each other due to the method. However, Marseille had a huge view of shooting short bursts befofehand and making a number of killings by this. Correct me....
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2022
  9. Bolshevik

    Bolshevik Active Member

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    This phenomenon is also present in tank crews.
    A few competent ones get the lion's share of the kills, and it happens with submarines as well.

    It seems that this is standard amongst fighter pilots, tank crews and submarines. They all have the same syndrome, where the best crews or individuals in the case of pilots get statistically the majority of the success..

    All the others are just along for the ride, present but ineffective.
     
  10. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    The circle was called a "Lufbery Circle"(also spelled Lufberry), after it's originator, or a "Defensive Circle". While it did well in protecting the defensive fighters in the horizontal plane, it was very susceptible to attacks in the vertical plane...Which is where Marseille excelled - attacks in the vertical. Despite the Lufberry Circle's failure to protect from vertical attacks, it had remained a common defensive tactic during the early years of WW2.
     
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  11. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    I read that Marseilles was a master of deflection shooting. He also befriended, Mathias, a South African black with whom he played chess against. Matthias was taken by JG27 back to Europe and post-war was executed for treason.

    Adam Makoos' A Higher Call should be read. While it concentrates on Lt. Charlie Brown and Franz Stigler (sp), it calls into practice the Luftwaffe false claims in Africa. Many of these did not stand up to post-war scrutiny against recorded RAF losses.

    Link to Mathias: Mathew ‘Mathias’ Letulu
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2022
  12. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    I recall the ground crew once counted Marseilles had once made a kill with some ten shots. Do not know if this is possible. I would think pressing the shoot button sends more bullets away.
     
  13. Carronade

    Carronade Ace

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    Perhaps he was only using the cannon? The two MG17s would fire ten shots in about 1/4 of a second, so I agree it seems unlikely. Nor would there seem to be much purpose to it.
     
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  14. harolds

    harolds Member

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    One thing about fighting in the vertical plane is that you don't have to take bullet trajectory so much into account. When shooting parallel to the ground, wind resistance, and thus gravity, alter the bullets trajectory downward. The more vertical you are, the less the bullet trajectory bends.
     
  15. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    Tracers help.

    Shooting uphill/downhill was finally figured out by the modern rifleman. It's briefly explained in my third book.

    Fighter pilots rely on tracers and strikes.
     
  16. Carronade

    Carronade Ace

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    The Motorkanone on the centerline of the aircraft was ideal for accurate shooting.
     
  17. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    Sorry my stupid question but was Il-2 The reason for the 2 cm cannon in the Bf-109 nose as I recall some German ace cursing the armor of Il-2 without the cannon but when he got the Bf-109 with 2 cm cannon he mentioned the Il-2's were dropping like flies?
     
  18. harolds

    harolds Member

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    Actually, the centerline cannon was supposed to be in the E model, but they didn't have it ready until the F version. You can see the hole in the spinner of the "Emil" but it took more time to get the system working. It was technical problems, not the IL-2, that delayed the centerline cannon. In later versions of the ME-109, they even mounted the 30mm MK 108 in the nose.
     
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  19. Carronade

    Carronade Ace

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    I don't think it related to a particular aircraft. The motor cannon concept dated back to WWI, and it was under consideration from the beginning of the design process for the Me109. However it was rarely mounted in 109s prior to the F model. I vaguely recall reading that there were vibration problems affecting the engine, the gun, or both. Also the 109E with which the Luftwaffe started the war had two 20mm cannons in the wings, so the nose gun wasn't crucial.

    The 109F was a major redesign, including accommodation for the mortorkanone; the wings were slimmer and could not have internal guns. The intent was to improve performance to keep up with opponents like the Spitfire. Some pilots complained about the apparent reduction in armament*, but this was more apparent than real; the motorkanone had 200 rounds vice 60/gun for the wing guns, a higher rate of fire, and avoided the need to harmonize the wing guns at a particular range.

    The MG151 cannon was originally a 15mm, but it was redesigned as a 20mm, designated MG151/20, which armed the vast majority of 109Fs and later.

    * Adolf Galland had a 109F modified with two 20mm FF cannons in the wings, the same type used in the 109E. This was an Oerlikon derivative using a 60-round drum which required a bulge under the wing.
     
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  20. harolds

    harolds Member

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    A little more on the 20mm FF cannons in the "Emil": As stated they were an Oerlikon design and were made for the light aircraft of the day. Thus, they were light, necessitating a reduced power/low recoil round. I believe the projectiles left the short barrel at 1600-1900 fps. It compensated for this by having thin-walled shells with a lot of explosive. This meant that while the ME 109 pilot had to get close, the explosive power of those rounds blew very large holes in the aluminum skin of British Spitfires and to a lesser extent, the Hurricane. These modern aircraft had a lot of their structural strength in the skin, so several hits could easily cause structural failure, especially under the stress of dogfighting. This concept was taken a step further with the 30mm MK 108 cannon that also had a low MV but a high capacity shell. These 20mm FF cannon were later used in bombers, such as the HE 111 in a hand-operated version.
     
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