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A Serious Kick in the Crotch!

Discussion in 'The Guns Galore Section' started by Boba Nette, Aug 9, 2004.

  1. Boba Nette

    Boba Nette New Member

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    As if the September 1 1939 invasion wasn't enough.....
    Several weeks before hand,an old German battleship sailed up a river to a port in Poland on a 'Goodwill' mission' accompanied by cheering and waving by the local residents.At a predetermined hour,the ships batteries opened fire on defensive strong points.All this was filmed by somebody.It was strange seeing a battleship just sitting in the river and lighting up everything in sight.Before today I'd never heard of the event.Anybody else got any info?

    Later

    SturmTiger
     
  2. Notmi

    Notmi New Member

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    Yes, it was an old pre-dreadnought Schleswig-Holstein, one of five Deutchland class battleships Germany build in first decade of 20th century. Armed with 4 11" guns (2x2), 14 17cm guns (14x1) and lighter guns. TT's were also fitted.
    She supported German invasion to Norway and Russia and supported German retreat from Russia. She also acted as icebreaker.
    December -44 she was badly damaged by british bombers, 21 of march -45 she was scuttled or sunk (my sources have different opinion about this) in shallow water. Later she was refloated by russians, used as training hulk and finally as target. Sunk in the Finnish sea in 1956.
     
  3. Boba Nette

    Boba Nette New Member

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    Thanks for the info.What was the date that she opened fire on?Was it before September 1?
     
  4. Notmi

    Notmi New Member

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    It was September 1.

    Some info about that ship:
    Laid down: August 1905
    Launched: 7th of December 1906
    Commissioned: 6th of July 1908

    History:
    cost: 25 Million Goldmark
    part of 2nd. Squadron
    fought at Battle of Jutland (Battle of Skagerak) May.31/16
    from 1917 depot ship at Bremerhaven
    from 1918 barrack ship at Kiel
    reconstructed 1925-26 and again 1930-31
    in service as Fleet Flagship
    used after Aug.1/36 as a Cadet School ship
    returned to active service through W.W.II
    Sep.1/39 fired on Polish fortifications on the Westerplatte near Danzig. this hostile action was the first of WWII
    severely damaged and burned out by 3 bombs from British A/C at Gotenhaven
    sank later in 12 meters of water
    awarded to the USSR as war reparation
    wreck was raised and transferred to to the Soviet's at Tallin.
    served until 1956 as a target vessel
    scuttled/sunk in the Finnish Sea.
    wreck remains there.

    Displacement: 13191 tons standard, 14218 tons maximum

    Dimensions:
    Lenght: 418.6' overall, 413 waterline
    Beam: 72.8'
    Draft 26.9'

    Propulsion:

    12 Marine Coal fired boilers
    8 Marine Coal + 6 Cylinder oil fired boilers ./15
    3 triple expansion steam engines
    20000 ihp
    3 shaft
    speed 18.5 knots
    endurance 5600 NM @ 12 knots (after refit)

    Armor:

    Armor belt: 9.5" on 3.1" teak backing
    Waterline belt: 3.9"
    Deck: 3.9"
    Turret face: 11"
    Turret roof: 2"
    Barbettes: 6.7"
    Forward conning tower: sides 11.8", roof 3.1"
    Aft conning tower: sides 5.5", roof 1.2"

    Info from cached www.warships1.com specification pages.
     
  5. Ebar

    Ebar New Member

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    Not a bad career for a ship that was obsolete before it entered service.
     
  6. Notmi

    Notmi New Member

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    Indeed.
     
  7. Ebar

    Ebar New Member

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    Although it has to be said taking such ships to the battle of Juland was probably the German Imperial Navy's biggest mistake of WW1. In a clash of dreadnoughts a squadron of pre dreadnoughts were literally liabilities.
     
  8. corpcasselbury

    corpcasselbury New Member

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    I agree. This error cost the High Seas Fleet the predreadnought POMMERN, which was sunk, IIRC, with all hands.
     
  9. corpcasselbury

    corpcasselbury New Member

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    The British, after WW1, wanted to keep the German Navy as weak as possible, to avoid any possible repetition of what had happened in that war. A wise decision, actually. Where the Brits erred very badly was in easing these naval restrictions, especially when they allowed the Germans to start building submarines again. This ensured that the Royal Navy and the Merchant Navy were going to suffer heavy losses in the next war, and they did.
     
  10. Ebar

    Ebar New Member

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    And it was only with some extremely fancy foot work that Scheer avoided loosing the bulk of the High Seas Fleet. That 18kt speed meant Scheer couldn't simply turn around and leg it. On the whole the Germans was wildy luckly to have only Pommern as their only total loss.
     
  11. Notmi

    Notmi New Member

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    Actually Germans had to scuttle Lutzow after that battle, she was flooded badly. HSF also lost several destroyers and atleast four cruisers.
    According to this page, HSF lost 11 ships and RN lost 14 ships.
     
  12. Ebar

    Ebar New Member

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    I didn't include Lutzow since the bulk of the crew got out but yes you are correct. It was the tendency for British ship to blow up that really produced the difference in number of dead.
     
  13. corpcasselbury

    corpcasselbury New Member

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    Yeah, that would tend to have such an effect...
     

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