Atrocities on Japanese Subs?

In 1944 two severe incidents happened on board the Japanese submarine I-8. The first was when 98 passengers and crew from a Dutch freighter were killed on the deck of the submarine, later the crew of an American merchantman led a similar fate.

I can't remember reading about similar incidents involving other Japanese submarines and was wondering if anybody knew more about these incidents.

 

the japanese were not the only submariners who left survivors on the surface to their fate wehn diving.

Submarines were not equiped to pick up more than a couple of survivers and especially not during long tours.

Plus enemy air crews would certainly attack any sub found on the surface leaving the peeps on the decks to their own fate, such was the general hatred of these "cowardly" boats. (despite the fact that all sides used them)

U boats also sank a lot of merchantmen with their deck gun sometimes before allowing them to get to their rafts, sometimes not. Either way they were surfaced when watching the ship go down and could see the fate of the opposing crew.

FNG

 

The passengers from the Dutch freighter were killed on the deck of the Japanese submarine, they weren't left in the water. I'm not sure if the crew from the American merchantman were killed on the deck, but they were killed by the crew of I-8. I believe there is a difference between leaving the passengers and crew of a sunken ship to their own destiny and kill them yourself.

 

its hard to beat the japs for plain old out and out sadistic cruelty ..ss special action troops seem tame by comparisin ..google up the 1937 rape of nanking if you want horror on an epic scale . the red army in east prussia was a bunch of boy scouts compared to the ija in china .

 

I like that line and i wana quote it.

 

lol, they were actually the same. You know, russian women totured by SS-Men, german girls raped by groups of drunken reds, burned cities in germany and russia on an epic scale as well, gues there is no difference in the suffering of human beings.

 

I hope not to sound ignorant on this, and I know there are some but can someone tell me of great crimes done by the western allies? I know there has to be some.

 

Well, some people look at the Allied bomber offensive as a whole as an atrocity, since the German and Japanese cities were destroyed, along with large portions of their civilians populations. The attack on Dresden in 1945 is specifically cited as a "war crime" by those who feel this way. The A-bomb attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki are viewed similarly. But the Allies had no death camps, nor did they employ slave labor in their war industries.

 

Caen?

FNG

 

When I was 18 as part of our A-levels we spent a week in Conrad Ardenauer (Sp?) centre in Germany, one German professor we had their spoke of SS PoWs captured by the US after the Malmedy Massacre in the Ardennes offensive, he commented that in many cases the captured soldiers testicles were "Destroyed", I can remember him making a point of that, not crushed, or removed but "destroyed". I'd like to make a point that the speakers there were not Nazi apologists, but normal Germans, there was one elderly lady who did fight the Nazis in the resistance, an SS soldier who joined up because the uniform looked great and found himself serving part of his career as a guard in a concentration camp and a Hitler Youth Flak Gunner who were among the speakers. I really wish I had paid greater attention at the time.

Dresden, firebombing when the war was practically over as a sop to Stalin who apparently commented that in the west the Germans seemed to be surrendering to the allies with great determination arguably could qualify, the machinegunning of Japanese soldiers abandoning sinking troop ships arguably could qualify.

Ironically Hiroshima and Nagasaki probably did the Japanese people as a whole a huge favour, far more people were killed in individual firebombing raids IIRC than in both A-bomb raids put together, the only difference being that in the case of Hiroshima and Nagasaki it was one plane and one bomb each.

Total war is a horrible business, I hope I never see it. Regrettably whilst many actions may be justified, no-one's side ever emerges entirely blameless.

 

I read citizen soldier, in the book Ambrose points out parts were American troops would shoot the surrendering Germans. I cant believe i wasnt thinking of the bombing at all, can you please enlighten me more on the gunning down of Japanese soldiers in the water? I know that Japanese ships were sunk off Guadalcanal and elsewhere and that Im guessing that they were strafed.

 

"Marocchinate (literally translatable as "Moroccaned") is a term applied to the victims of the mass rape committed after the Battle of Monte Cassino by Goumiers, colonial troops of the French Expeditionary Corps (CEF), commanded by general Alphonse Juin."

Check this out

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marocchinate

http://members.iinet.net.au/~gduncan/ma ... html#Italy


These are just quotes, allright.

Regards,
Che.

 

I have no doubt that atrocities were commited by all sides in most all conflicts ever fought.

After word of the Malmedy Massacre circulated, American GI's no-doubt took few if any German prisoners. I can't say I blame them. That single action did more to firm-up the defenders resolve than a "pep-talk" by General Patton. Any trooper that comes to the realization he will be killed if captured will fight that much harder and stand his ground in the face of overwhelming odds.

In the Pacific campaigns, US Marines learned quickly that the Japanese gave no quarter and their fight was to the death.
The Fifth Air Force used ground-strafing, skip-bombing B-25s to decimate troop-ships attempting to reinforce Japanese strongpoints in the New Guinea campaign. Were helpless Japanese troops machine-gunned in the water? You bet. The mission was to deny any reinforcements to the Japanese. They were killed both on their troop-ships, in the water and on the beach if they made it that far.
The USS Wahoo captained by "Mush" Morton were known to have machine-gunned Japanese troops in the water.

In Korea, NKA troops were fond of torturing and murdering American troops they had overrun in those early, frantic days of the "Pusan Perimeter." When counter-attacking Marines re-occupied these positions, they found the bodies of GI's with their hands tied behind their backs, shot in the head and/or bayoneted.
In one instance, an officers eyes were gouged-out, his thumbs pulled-off, and he and another wounded officer were set on fire. The North Koreans were capable of extreme brutality. Needless to say, the GIs and Marines responded in kind, and took few prisoners after that knowledge became commonplace.

Tim

 

It happens certain and yet it's basically self defeating. Someone who thinks he'll be shuffled into a POW camp where the worse result is watching several years of their life crawl past has an incentive to surrender. If you opponent is beaten but knows (or believes) if he puts his hand up, the best he can expect is a bullet in the back of the head, well... he ain't putting his hands up. You'll probably have to take out every last of one them the hard way.

 

About incidents with I-8:

 

Allied:

The only problem with this account here is that id doesn't mention that few thousands of the "enemy" floating in the sea and killed by Morton were acctualy Indian POW's on route to Japan as slave labourers.

 

HMS Torbay:

 

can anyone post the lacona spl? sinking , a uboat sinks a brit transport then discovers the sea awash with italian pows ,he puts the brit women and children aboard the sub and attempts to tow the lifeboats packed full of italians to the nearest shore ..a true story of a uboat action that goes against the common notion of german brutality.

 

anytime word gets out about pows being murdered , ie. mamedy ,pusan retreat ,bataan ..you can always bet there will be plenty of revenge killings wether sanctioned or not ..its alway a sad thing to me because you have to know that the prisoners being killed in reprisal are never ever the same guilty guys who started the whole ugly bussines , they are just some unlucky shmucks who happen to be caught in the same colored uniform as the original perpetators

imo ,a sub skipper can be justfied in killing troops in lifeboats if he suspects they will soon be rescued by their comrads because a sub skipper has no option to take the pows on board his boat .killing pows on land is not ever justified as they can always be marched to the rear under gaurd . and killing prisoners just insures that your next fight will be that much harder because they will now fight to the last man .

 

Not if you are on a long patrol of the enemy's rear areas, like the Chindits for example.