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B-17 Crash

Discussion in 'Living History' started by harolds, Nov 12, 2022.

  1. harolds

    harolds Member

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    Just saw this on breaking news! A B-17 and a P-63 Aircobra collided at an air show at the Dallas Executive Airport. There are some videos of the crash. It looks to me like the Aircobra pilot is at fault.There was no word as to exactly what B-17 was destroyed. From the video, I doubt any survivors.
     
  2. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    B-17 was the "Texas Raiders", of the Gulf Coast Wing, of the Commemorative Air Force.

    Just coming across my news feed while leaving work.
     
  3. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    IIRC, the B-17 had the right-of-way. But, judging from the banking turn the P-63 was in, the P-63 pilot probably never saw the B-17.

    Hard to tell if the P-63 was in a descending banking turn, or lost just enough altitude in the turn to collide with Texas Raiders.
     
  4. harolds

    harolds Member

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    My take on it was that the P-63 pilot was "hot dogging" it and possibly making a faux firing pass on the bomber. The bomber was doing a fairly low-slow fly-over. So, either the P-63 pilot misjudged his pass and/or the B-17 pilot was pulling up to gain more altitude. Either way, the P-63 pilot shouldn't having been doing that. I agree that when the fighter started to pull up, neither pilot could see the other a/c.
     
  5. Biak

    Biak Adjutant Staff Member Patron  

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    As Takao said.

    upload_2022-11-12_17-53-59.png
     
  6. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    Maybe, to form up, but I doubt it.

    In some decades of air shows, I have never seen a "firing pass" form up by coming in perpendicular to the "target." To form up, the "target" always flew a base course, and the "shooter" would come in on the "target's" Six.
     
  7. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

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    Shouldn’t of happened.
     
  8. harolds

    harolds Member

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    What you are talking about are rehearsed "combats". This didn't have the feel that this was rehearsed. Plainly, the P-63 shouldn't have been there. The B-17 should have been visible to the P-63 pilot as he came in. I just can't see this as being something that was condoned by the air controllers. It may remain an mystery forever.
     
  9. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    What little I have found report that the P-63 was in a descending turn to land. If true, the B-17 should not have been where it was. Sounding more like ATC screwed the pooch or maybe the B-17.

    At MAAM WW2 Weekend, 2 planes were never in such close proximity as this. Show planes kept well cleat of the runway while another was landing, orbiting at a safe distance.

    NTSB should be there some time today(Sunday)
     
  10. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    Agree, this was easily preventable
     
  11. ULITHI

    ULITHI Ace

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    3F248FB1-56BF-4869-AE86-889CA42ED686.jpeg 667B5B04-2AD8-49FA-8AC6-7444ACB8300D.jpeg 0F49C635-3775-4081-919C-98766DC18315.jpeg

    I got choked up when I first saw this story this morning.
    She was the first B-17 I ever saw up close. I got to photograph her in high school photography class back in 1997. I dug out a few photos. RIP girl, and to the souls lost on both planes.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2022
    CAC likes this.
  12. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    Coroner has confirmed 6 deaths.

    American Airlines has confirmed 2 were retired AA pilots.
     
  13. mcoffee

    mcoffee Son-of-a-Gun(ner)

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    The P-63 was not setting up to land - clean configuration. The fast aircraft were lapping to the left side of the runway based on a front view I found last night with a P-51 ahead of the slower B-17 on the right side of the runway. The P-63 seemed to overshoot the turn and wound up outside where he should have been. The B-17 would have been on his belly side and probably out of sight.
     
  14. T. A. Gardner

    T. A. Gardner Genuine Chief

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    It looks like the P-63 pilot couldn't see the B-17 being rolled away and lacked the situational awareness to avoid the accident.
     
  15. ColHessler

    ColHessler Member

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    I saw the crash on YouTube. I agree with T.A. It looked like the P-63 was lost.
     
  16. Ricky

    Ricky Well-Known Member

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    A double tradegy. 6 livesand 2 beautiful aircraft lost.
     
  17. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    USMCPrice and CAC like this.
  18. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

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    Wow...Sounds very possible.
    Except: Others should have seen and recorded said drone. - The drone should have sprayed shrapnel pieces. - Unlikely a drone striking a prop would damage the prop, the drone for weight reasons is made of mostly plastic and the momentum ratio would favour the props highly. Different story if its a bird or even something coming off an aircraft ahead.
     
  19. Biak

    Biak Adjutant Staff Member Patron  

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    It looks pretty obvious 'something' happened to cause the P63 to bank left and descend. I'm sure the NTSB will determine the cause.
     
  20. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

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    Sure something happened...Heart attack?
     

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