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Battle of Berlin, 1945

Discussion in 'Information Requests' started by XcombatX, Sep 20, 2008.

  1. XcombatX

    XcombatX Member

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    Hi,
    I've got a question about the weapons (artillery, canons) and vehicles (tanks, support vehicles) used during the Battle of/in Berlin.
    Does anyone have a complete list or something similar which shows the complete garrison of the Soviet (including lent-lease) and German forces?

    I would like to have this, because I'm currently working on a series of drawings about this battle and I don't want to show incorrect units. :)
     
  2. T. A. Gardner

    T. A. Gardner Genuine Chief

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    Quite frankly, I don't think anything close to a complete list ever existed or will exist, particularly for the Germans. There were just too many ad hoc units using whatever was available for such a list to exist.
    It should be more possible to do a Soviet list.
     
  3. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    I agree with T.A.. It was so chaotic at the end to be able to keep detailed records of units and weapons for the Germans. In the end they used whatever then could get thier hands on for the defence. All kinds of odds and ends. Especially AFVs and vehices.
     
  4. XcombatX

    XcombatX Member

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    I understand. But do you know a few vehicles and/or weapons they most certainly have used? Like Königstigers and T34/85's?
     
  5. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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  6. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    And this is from my thread on WWI tanks in WWII,

    "I was perusing some material on the Fall of Berlin, and I came across a photo of a British MkV Rhomboid Tank that was used in the battle by the Germans. Upon further reading, it appears to be one of the tanks that the British gave to the "White" Russians during the revolution. At the outbreak of Barbarossa, the Soviets used at least 4 surviving MkV's in the defense of Estonia near Tallinn. The Berlin tank is most likely one of these."

    [​IMG]

    http://www.ww2f.com/weapons-wwii/22200-wwi-tanks-wwii.html
     
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  7. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    another example of an odd and end used.



    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    The Wilton-Fijenoord
    An experimental type. After satisfying trials two of these cars were shipped to the East Indies in 1934. Results there were less satisfactory, the vehicles being too heavy for the roads and the aircooled engines suffereing from overheating, forcing the use of airplane gas rather than the normal gasoline. The 2 cars thus were sold back to the firm and returned to the Netherlands.
    In February 1935 two vehicles were sold to Brazil. The third remained at the firm untill they managed to sell it to the army in return of a tax-reduction. June 1st 1938 the vehicle was issued to the Korps Rijdende Artillerie (Corps mobile Artillery), that already had the five Carden Lloyd tankettes and the three Morris armored cars.
    It however was never armed because of lack of money. Of course it wasn’t used in May 1940. The Germans re-activated it in April 1945 for the defence of Berlin, still unarmed.

    http://mailer.fsu.edu/~akirk/tanks/hol/Wilton.jpg
     
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  8. XcombatX

    XcombatX Member

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  9. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    do you have info's on the III. SS Schwere Panzer Abteilung equipped with the Königstiger which did great damage to the Soviet forces outside and in Berlin
     
  10. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    IIRC too the Soviets used T-34/85s,JS-IIs and M4A2/76 Shermans among other vehicles.
     
  11. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Appendix 2: German Order of Battle for Operation Berlin (Le Tissier, pp. 208 – 214)

    Those units directly involved with the defence of Berlin are shown in more detail.

    OKW RESERVE (later allocated to the LVI Panzer Corps, 9th Army)
    18th Panzergrenadier Division (Maj Gen Josef Rauch)
    30th & 51st Panzergrenadier Regts
    118th Panzer Regt (part)
    18th Artillery Regt
    ARMY GROUP ‘VISTULA’ (Col Gen Gotthard Heinrici)
    III SS ‘Germanic’ Panzer Corps (SS Lt Gen Felix Steiner)
    (divisions later allocated to the 9th Army)
    11th SS ‘Nordland’ Panzergrenadier Division (SS Maj Gen Jurgen Ziegler / SS Maj Gen Dr Gustav Krukenburg)
    23rd ‘Norge’ Panzergrenadier Regt
    24th ‘Danmark’ Panzergrenadier Regt
    11th SS ‘Hermann von Salza’ Panzer Btn
    503rd SS Heavy Tank Btn
    11th SS ‘Nordland’ Armoured Reconnaissance Btn
    23rd SS ‘Nederland’ Panzergrenadier Division (SS Maj Gen Wagner)
    (divisions later allocated to the 3rd Panzer Army)
    27th SS ‘Langemarck’ Grenadier Division
    28th SS ‘Wallonien’ Grenadier Division
    3rd Panzer Army (Gen Hasso von Manteuffel)
    ‘Swinemunde’ Corps (Lt Gen Ansat)
    402nd & 2nd Naval Divisions
    XXXII Corps (Lt Gen Schack)
    ‘Voigt’ & 281st Infantry Divisions
    549th Volksgrenadier Division
    Stettin Garrison
    ‘Oder’ Corps (SS Lt Gen von dem Bach / Gen Hörnlein)
    610th & ‘Klossek’ Infantry Divisions
    XXXXVI Panzer Corps (Gen Martin Gareis)
    547th Volksgrenadier Division
    1st Naval Division
    9th Army (Gen Theodor Busse)
    156th Infantry Division
    541st Volksgrenadier Division
    404th Volks Artillery Corps
    406th Volks Artillery Corps
    408th Volks Artillery Corps
    CI Corps (Gen Wilhelm Berlin / Lt Gen Friedrich Sixt)
    5th Light Infantry Division
    606th Infantry Division
    309th ‘Berlin’ Infantry Division
    25th Panzergrenadier Division
    111th SPG Training Bde
    ‘1001 Nights’ Combat Group
    LVI Panzer Corps (Gen Helmuth Weidling)
    9th Fallschirmjäger Division (Gen Bruno Braüer / Col Harry Herrmann)
    25th, 26th & 27th Fallschirmjäger Regts
    9th Fallschirmjäger Artillery Regt
    20th Panzergrenadier Division (Col / Maj Gen Georg Scholze)
    76th & 90th Panzergrenadier Regts
    8th Panzer Btn
    20th Artillery Regt
    ‘Müncheberg’ Panzer Division (Maj Gen Werner Mummert)
    1st & 2nd ‘Müncheberg’ Panzergrenadier Regts
    ‘Müncheberg’ Panzer Regt
    ‘Müncheburg’ Armoured Artillery Regt
    920th SPG Training Bde
    XI SS Panzer Corps (SS Gen Mathias Kleinheisterkamp)
    303rd ‘Döberitz’ Infantry Division
    169th Infantry Division
    712th Infantry Division
    ‘Kurmark’ Panzergrenadier Division
    502nd SS Heavy Tank Btn
    Frankfurt an der Oder Garrison (Col / Maj Gen Ernst Biehler)
    V SS Mountain Corps (SS Gen Friedrich Jackeln)
    286th Infantry Division
    32nd SS ’30. Januar’ Volksgrenadier Division
    391st Sy Division
    561st SS Tank Hunting Btn
    ARMY GROUP CENTRE (Field Marshal Ferdinand Schörner)
    4th Panzer Army (Gen Fritz-Herbert Gräser)
    (later transferred to the 9th Army)
    V Corps (Lt Gen Wagner)
    35th SS Police Grenadier Division
    36th SS Grenadier Division
    275th Infantry Division
    342nd Infantry Division
    21st Panzer Division
    12th Army (Gen Walter Wenck)
    XX Corps (Gen Carl-Erik Koehler)
    ‘Theodor Körner’ RAD Division
    ‘Ulrich von Hutten’ Infantry Division
    ‘Ferdinand von Schill’ Infantry Division
    ‘Scharnhorst’ Infantry Division
    XXXIX Panzer Corps (Lt Gen Karl Arndt)
    (12 – 21 April 1945 under OKW with the following structure)
    ‘Clausewitz’ Panzer Division
    ‘Schlageter’ RAD Division
    84th Infantry Division
    (21 – 26 April 1945 under 12th Army with the following structure)
    ‘Clausewitz’ Panzer Division
    84th Infantry Division
    ‘Hamburg’ Reserve Infantry Division
    ‘Meyer’ Infantry Division
    XXXXI Panzer Corps (Lt Gen Holste</I>)
    ‘von Hake’ Infantry Division
    199th Infantry Division
    ‘V-Weapons’ Infantry Division
    1st HJ Tank Destroyer Bde
    ‘Hermann Göring’ Jagdpanzer Bde
    XXXXVIII Panzer Corps (Gen Maximillian Reichsherr von Edelscheim)
    14th Flak Division
    ‘Leipzig’ Battle Group
    ‘Halle’ Battle Group

    Ungrouped Formations ‘Friedrich Ludwig Jahn’ RAD Division (Col Gerhard Klein / Col Franz Weller)
    ‘Potsdam’ Infantry Division (Col Erich Lorenz)"

    Antill, P., Battle for Berlin: April – May 1945, Battle for Berlin: April – May 1945
     
  12. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Appendix 1: Soviet Order of Battle for the Battle for Berlin (Le Tissier, pp. 196 – 207)

    Units are listed as they were deployed from north to south on 16 April 1945, with those having assaulted the city in greater detail.

    2ND BYELORUSSIAN FRONT (Marshal K. K. Rokossovsky)
    2nd Shock Army (Col Gen I. I. Fedyurinsky)
    108th & 116th Rifle Corps
    65th Army (Col Gen P. I. Batov)
    18th, 46th & 105th Rifle Corps
    70th Army (Col Gen V. S. Popov)
    47th, 96th & 114th Rifle Corps
    49th Army (Col Gen I. T. Grishin)
    70th & 121st Rifle Corps
    191st, 200th & 330th Rifle Divisions
    19th Army
    40th Guards, 132nd & 134th Rifle Corps
    5th Guards Tank Army
    29th Tank Corps
    1st Tank & 4th Mechanised Bdes
    4th Air Army (Col Gen K. A. Vershinin)
    4th Air Assault, 5th Air Bomber and 8th Air Fighter Corps
    1ST BYELORUSSIAN FRONT (Marshal G. K. Zhukov)
    61st Army (Col Gen P. A. Belov)
    9th Guards, 80th & 89th Rifle Corps
    1st Polish Army (Lt Gen S. G. Poplowski)
    1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th & 6th Polish Infantry Divisions
    1st Polish Cavalry Bde
    4th Polish Heavy Tank Bde
    13th Polish SP Assault Artillery Bde
    7th Polish Assault Artillery Btn
    47th Army (Lt Gen F. I. Perkhorovitch)
    77th, 125th & 129th Rifle Corps
    70th Guards Independent Tank Regt
    334th, 1204th, 1416th, 1825th & 1892nd SP Assault Artillery Regts
    3rd Shock Army (Col Gen V. I. Kutznetsov)
    7th Rifle Corps (Maj Gen V. A. Christov / Col Gen Y. T. Chyervichenko)
    146th, 265th & 364th Rifle Divisions
    12th Guards Rifle Corps (Lt Gen A. F. Kazanin / Maj Gen A. A. Filatov)
    23rd Guards, 52nd Guards & 33rd Rifle Divisions
    79th Rifle Corps (Maj Gen S. I. Perevertkin)
    150th Rifle Division (Maj Gen V. M. Shatilov)
    469th, 674th & 756th Rifle Regts
    171st Rifle Division (Col A. P. Negoda)
    380th, 525th & 783rd Rifle Regts
    207th Rifle Division (Col V. M. Asafov)
    594th, 597th & 598th Rifle Regts
    9th Tank Corps (Lt Gen I. F. Kirichenko)
    23rd, 95th & 108th Tank Bdes
    8th Motorised Rifle Regt
    1455th & 1508th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    5th Shock Army (Gen / Col Gen N. E. Berzarin)
    9th Rifle Corps (Maj Gen / Lt Gen I. P. Rossly)
    230th, 248th & 301st Rife Divisions
    26th Guards Corps (Maj Gen P. A. Firsov)
    89th Guards, 94th Guards & 266th Rifle Divisions
    32nd Rifle Corps (Lt Gen D. S. Zherebin)
    60th Guards, 295th & 416th Rifle Divisions
    11th, 67th Guards & 220th Tank Bdes
    92nd Independent Tank Regt
    396th Guards & 1504th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    8th Guards Army (Col Gen V. I. Chuikov)
    4th Guards Rifle Corps (Lt Gen V. A. Glazonov)
    35th Guards, 47th Guards & 57th Guards Rifle Divisions
    28th Guards Rifle Corps (Lt Gen V. M. Shugeyev)
    39th Guards, 79th Guards & 88th Guards Rifle Divisions
    29th Guards Rifle Corps (Maj Gen P. I. Zalizyuk)
    27th Guards, 74th Guards & 82nd Guards Rifle Divisions
    7th Guards Tank Bde
    84th Guards, 65th & 259th Independent Tank Regts
    371st, 374th Guards, 694th, 1026th, 1061st, 1087th & 1200th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    69th Army (Col Gen V. Y. Kolpakchi)
    25th, 61st & 91st Rifle Corps
    117th & 283rd Rifle Divisions
    68th Tank Bde
    12th SP Assault Artillery Bde
    344th Guards, 1205th, 1206th & 1221st SP Assault Artillery Regts
    33rd Army (Col Gen V. D. Svotaev)
    16th, 38th & 62nd Rifle Corps
    2nd Guards Cavalry Corps
    95th Rifle Division
    257th Independent Tank Regt
    360th & 361st SP Assault Artillery Regts
    16th Air Army (Col Gen S. I. Rudenko)
    6th & 9th Air Assault Corps
    3rd & 6th Air Bomber Corps
    1st Guards, 3rd, 6th & 13th Air Fighter Corps
    1st Guards, 240th, 282nd & 286th Air Fighter Divisions
    2nd & 11th Guards Air Assault Divisions
    113th, 183rd, 188th & 221st Air Bomber Divisions
    9th Guards & 242nd Air Night Bomber Divisions
    16th & 72nd Air Reconnaissance Regts
    93rd & 98th Air Observation Regts
    176th Guards Air Fighter Regt
    226th Air Transport Regt
    18th Air Army (AVM A. Y. Golovanov)
    1st Guards, 2nd, 3rd & 4th Air Bomber Corps
    45th Air Bomber Division
    56th Air Fighter Division
    742nd Air Reconnaissance Regt
    1st Guards Tank Army (Col Gen M. Y. Katukov)
    8th Guards Mechanised Corps (Maj Gen I. F. Drygemov)
    19th, 20th & 21st Guards Mechanised Bdes
    1st Guards Tank Bde
    48th Guards Tank Regt
    353rd & 400th Guards SP Assault Artillery Regts
    8th Guards M/C Btn
    11th Guards Tank Corps (Col A. H. Babadshanian)
    40th, 44th & 45th Guards Tank Bdes
    27th Guards Mechanised Bde
    362nd, 399th Guards & 1454 SP Assault Artillery Regts
    9th Guards M/C Btn
    11th Tank Corps (Maj Gen I. I. Jushuk)
    20th, 36th & 65th Tank Bdes
    12th Motorised Rifle Bde
    50th Guards Tank Regt
    1461st & 1493rd SP Assault Artillery Regts
    64th Guards Tank Bde
    19th SP Assault Artillery Bde
    11th Guards Independent Tank Regt
    12th Guards M/C Btn
    2nd Guards Tank Army (Col Gen S. I. Bogdanov)
    1st Mechanised Corps (Lt Gen S. I. Krivosheina)
    19th, 35th & 37th Mechanised Bdes
    219th Tank Bde
    347th Guards, 75th & 1822nd SP Assault Artillery Regts
    57th M/C Btn
    9th Guards Tank Corps (Maj Gen A. F. Popov)
    47th, 50th & 65th Guards Tank Bdes
    33rd Guards Mechanised Bde
    341st, 369th & 386th Guards SP Assault artillery Regts
    17th Guards M/C Btn
    12th Guards Tank Corps (Maj Gen M. K. Teltakov / Col A. T. Shevchenko)
    48th, 49th & 66th Guards Tank Bdes
    34th Guards Mechanised Bde
    79th Guards Tank Regt
    387th & 393rd Guards SP Assault Artillery Regts
    6th Guards Independent Tank Regt
    5th Guards M/C Regt
    16th Guards M/C Btn
    3rd Army (Col Gen A. V. Gorbatov)
    35th, 40th & 41st Rifle Corps
    1812th, 1888th & 1901st SP Assault Artillery Regts
    2nd, 3rd & 7th Guards Cavalry Corps
    3rd & 8th Guards Tank Corps
    244th Independent Tank Regt
    31st, 39th, 51st & 55th Independent Armoured Train Btns
    1ST UKRAINIAN FRONT (Marshal I. S. Koniev)
    3rd Guards Army (Col Gen V. N. Gordov)
    21st, 76th & 120th Rifle Corps
    25th Tank Corps
    389th Rifle Division
    87th Guards Independent Tank Regt
    938th SP Assault Artillery Regt
    13th Army (Col Gen N. P. Phukov)
    24th, 27th & 102nd Rifle Corps
    88th Independent Tank Regt
    327th, 372nd Guards, 768th & 1228th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    5th Guards Army (Col Gen A. S. Zhadov)
    32nd, 33rd & 34th Guards Rifle Corps
    4th Guards Tank Corps
    2nd Polish Army (Lt Gen K. K. Swiersczewski)
    5th, 7th, 8th, 9th & 10th Polish Infantry Divisions
    1st Polish Tank Corps
    16th Polish Tank Bde
    5th Polish Independent Tank Regt
    28th polish SP Assault Artillery Regt
    52nd Army (Col Gen K. A. Koroteyev)
    48th, 73rd & 78th Rifle Corps
    7th Guards Mechanised Corps
    213th Rifle Division
    8th SP Assault Artillery Bde
    124th Independent Tank Regt
    1198th SP Assault Artillery Regt
    2nd Air Army (Col Gen S. A. Krasovsky)
    1st Guards, 2nd Guards & 3rd Air Assault Corps
    4th & 6th Guards Air Bomber Corps
    2nd, 5th & 6th Air Fighter Corps
    208th Air Night Bomber Division
    98th & 193rd Guards Air Reconnaissance Regts
    222nd Air Transport Regt
    3rd Guards Tank Army (Col Gen P. S. Rybalko)
    6th Guards Tank Corps (Maj Gen V. A. Mitrofanov)
    51st, 52nd & 53rd Guards Tank Bdes
    22nd Guards Motorised Rifle Bde
    385th Guards, 1893rd & 1894th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    3rd Guards M/C Btn
    7th Guards Tank Corps (Maj Gen V. V. Novikov)
    54th, 55th & 56th Guards Tank Bdes
    23rd Guards Motorised Rifle Bde
    384th Guards, 702nd & 1977th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    4th Guards M/C Btn
    9th Mechanised Corps (Lt Gen I. P. Suchov)
    69th, 70th & 71st Mechanised Bdes
    91st Tank Bde
    383rd Guards, 1507th & 1978th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    100th M/C Btn
    16th SP Assault Artillery Bde
    57th Guards & 90th Independent Tank Regts
    50th M/C Regt
    4th Guards Tank Army (Col Gen D. D. Lelyushenko)
    5th & 6th Guards Mechanised Corps
    10th Guards Tank Corps
    68th Guards Tank Bde
    70th Guards SP Assault Artillery Bde
    13th & 119th Guards Independent Tank Regts
    7th Guards M/C Regt
    28th Army (Lt Gen A. A. Luchinsky)
    20th, 38th Guards & 128th Rifle Corps 31st Army
    1st Guards Cavalry Corps (Lt Gen V. K. Baranov)
    152nd Tank Bde
    98th Independent Tank Regt
    368th Guards, 416th & 1976th SP Assault Artillery Regts
    21st, 45th, 49th & 58th Independent Armoured Train Btns
     
  13. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    Das Ende Zwischen Oder Und Elbe Der Kampf Um Berlin 1945. JC several of the German named units had nothing to do with Berlin except the fact they were fighting east of the big city and retreated not within as for some but to the north and south not to be entrapped by the Soviets.

    for years this has been a huge bone of contention with the few surviving German units that did bleed out in the capital and the units that were termed "cheaters" by moving continaully westward towards US captivity. .......interesting I think
     
  14. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    I think that the heading was meant to mean that this was the official OOB but the units that were actually involved are "shown with in more detail". I don't think that it was meant to mean that all the units were actually involved in the battle. Thats the jist I get. But thats just my opinion LOL.

    Appendix 2: German Order of Battle for Operation Berlin (Le Tissier, pp. 208 – 214)

    Those units directly involved with the defence of Berlin are shown in more detail.
     
  15. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    possibly it could easily work both ways and it has with numerous books published since the 1950's. The Battle of Berlin in name is a strange one as for the Luftwaffe it was a projection of protection for the capital city since January 1945's end till end of the war. In fact interviewing LW veterans that participated on the Ost front use the term in regards to all aerial conflict with the Soviets, there is not one "special" date to be used above any other. A close friend serving in the Heer although he was fighting up in ost Preussia, his remarks is that it all ran together , we just surivied and tried to exist from day to day during the actions of defense and brief counter-thrusts agasint the Soviets. the W-SS 561st Panzer-jagd Abt. was in the same mode defending in the trees to the east of Berlin taking on whatever the Soviets tried to push through, closing small gaps defending Heer/Fallshirmtruppen, brief counterattack followed by retreat amidst buildings and heavy timber growth what wasn't already blown to bits. Sucidal attacks by both sides, brief lulls and then all hell breaks loose again ....
     

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