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Croatian Archbishop Aloysius Stepinac sentence reversed after 70 years

Discussion in 'WWII Today' started by Skipper, Jul 22, 2016.

  1. Skipper

    Skipper Kommodore

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  2. YugoslavPartisan

    YugoslavPartisan Drug

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    Another disgraceful move by Croatia. That guy converted thousands of Orthodox Serbs to Catholicism and was alongside Pavelić and Ustashas throughout the whole war. Canonising him will be just another dirty move by Vatican.
     
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  3. Skipper

    Skipper Kommodore

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    It is true that he converted people who had no real choice, but is that considered a war crime? He actually clearly condemned war crimes and helped Jews to escape.

    "Despite initially welcoming the Independent State of Croatia, Stepinac subsequently condemned the Nazi-aligned state's atrocities against Jews and Serbs" "He objected to the persecution of Jews and Nazi laws, helped Jews and others to escape and criticized Ustaše atrocities in front of Zagreb Cathedral in 1943.[4] Despite this, Stepinac never broke with the Ustaše regime and continued to attend public gatherings at their side".

    The fact that he condemned the Communists for having executed Catholic priests didn't plead for his popularity after 1945.

    Canonising may be a bit far fetched I agree.
     
  4. Tamino

    Tamino Doc - The Deplorable

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    Declaring Stepinac innocent equals to consecration of Adolf Eichman. Stepinac is shame for Chatolic Church. This is really a shamefull decision by Croatian lawmakers.
     
  5. YugoslavPartisan

    YugoslavPartisan Drug

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    It is true that he helped some Jews to escape but being with Ustashas until the end despite the fact he knew what they were doing and that they will definitely lose the war made him a criminal in front of the eyes of Yugoslav people. It is also true that he got a "better" treatment than most of the people connected with Ustasha regime. He was in Lepoglava prison and by the end of his life he was in home prison which is paradise compared to mass killings of other people connected with Ustashas.

    Partisans did kill Catholic priests and monks but they were far from innocent. Catholic church of Croatia today just tells you that "communists killed priests and monks" but they don't tell you the whole story. Those priests and monks were connected to Ustasha regime and were giving away the positions of partisan hospitals in the woods which often led to the massacres of the wounded and a lot of civilians which were at those hospitals. From my point of view I justify the killings of those priests and monks no matter how harsh it may sound.

    I also have to point out that there were many priests and monks which fought alongside partisans and helped the wounded and hungry which equals with the techings of the church and I respect them just like the communist regime of Yugoslavia respected them for helping people. They were even awarded with various medals.

    Catholic church of Croatia also tends to demonize partisans as being anti-Croatian, satanist and even Chetinks which is nonsense. Over 90% of partisans were religious and there was always a religious ceremony when they burried the fallen comrades.

    Here's one of many pictures proving it.
    [​IMG]

    I also have to point out that despite the fact that Croatian Catholic church is obviously a joke and a slave of the authorities, I respect religion and religious people even if I'm not religious myself.
     
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  6. Skipper

    Skipper Kommodore

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    I'd be interested in hearing more about this man. I only find two kind sources : they are both biased (both sides from the cold war area) . Wiki is clearly inpired by the western point of view .

    On the other hand comparing him to Eichmann seems a bit extreme too. I understand he supported fascist meetings, but he condemned massacres .

    His war activities were used against him in 1946 because he opposed the Communists : (from wikipedia)

    In an effort to put a stop to the archbishop's activities, Tito attempted to reach an accord with Stepinac, and achieve a greater degree of independence for the Catholic Church in Yugoslavia and Croatia.[110][page needed] Stepinac refused to break from the Vatican, and continued to publicly condemn the communist government. Tito, however, was reluctant to bring him to trial, in spite of condemning evidence which was available.[1] Abandoning the strive towards increased Church independence, Tito first attempted to persuade Stepinac to cease his activities.[citation needed] When this too failed, in January 1946 the federal government attempted to solicit his replacement with the Vatican, a request that was denied. Finally, Stepinac was himself asked to leave the country, which he refused.
     
  7. YugoslavPartisan

    YugoslavPartisan Drug

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    Stepinac was born in Krašić near Karlovac in 1898. I even was in front of the house where he was born because my friend has a vacation house nearby so I wanted to check it out. He fought in the WWI for Austria-Hungary on the Italian front and was POW in Italy. Later on he was in the church (I don't know which positions he had) and eventually became the archbishop of the Ustasha regime. Even in Kingdom of Yugoslavia he had pro-Croatian attitude. That's all which is important to know about him before the WWII.

    When Independent State of Croatia was proclaimed in April 10th, 1941 by Slavko Kvaternik he widely greeted the new authority which was glorified for finaly creating Croatia and making it "independent". After only five days after proclaiming the country (April 15th) Ustashas opened the first death camp in Koprivnica called Danica. First prisoners were a local Serb, Jewish and Romani men. By the 15th July there were over 2600 prisoners in the camp so they transported around 2000 prisoners to Gospić (Jadovno death camp) where they were thrown into pits alive. One of those victims which were killed at Jadovno was my great-great-grandfather which served in the KuK. I wrote about him here: http://www.ww2f.com/topic/57174-zugsfuhrer-sergeant-of-the-austria-hungary-infantry-jagodi%C4%87-1941/

    Stepinac was against the crimes and wrote to Pavelić to stop with the killings but that's all he did. Funny thing is that his brother was in partisans and was killed by the Germans. Today no one is talking about it because partisans were "bloodthirsty communists and anti-Croats". He knew about it but did nothing on the matter. Possibly because he feared what will happen to him if he reacted. In one letter to Pavelić on the subject of transportation of prisoners to Jasenovac and Stara Gradiška death camps he wrote that the conditions in the transport train were awful. It was crowded with hungry and sick people and the people could barely move in it. He wrote that they should give them some water until proceeding with transportation. He did not oppose to the fact they were going to death camp. Stepinac also wrote to Pavelić asking his permission for converting empty Orthodox temples (guess why they were empty...) into Catholic ones.

    He blessed Ustasha and Home guard forces as being the real Croatian army.

    He got 16 years prison sentence at Lepoglava but was released by Tito's command on the condition of him being in the home imprisonment or a deportation to Vatican. He choose to stay at his home where he died years after.

    Here's my objective point of view of the man.

    I think he played his role very cunningly. He supported Ustasha beliefs and often glorified Pavelić for leading an "independent" Croatia but on the other hand disapproved it's crimes. I can't say that he was a war criminal which he clearly wasn't but he was definately a Nazi and Ustasha collaborator for which he got a fair sentence which some of the collaborators in the countries of western bloc didn't have.
     
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  8. mac_bolan00

    mac_bolan00 Member

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    what's this, another jews-as-the-exclusive-victims-of-persecution song?
     
  9. Tamino

    Tamino Doc - The Deplorable

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    No, Stepinac has targeted predominantly other victims. His selection criteria was religion and his victims were predominantly Ortodox Christians. He is a shame for the Chatolic Church and pardoning him is an insult both to Chatolics and Croats.
     

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