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Does Chobham armour resist multiple hits?

Discussion in 'Post-World War 2 Armour' started by PanzerMeister, Mar 20, 2005.

  1. PanzerMeister

    PanzerMeister New Member

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    Split from "Interesting video about Gatling Gun"

    Didn't somebody here in forum say, that Chobham breaks if it is hit many times?
     
  2. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    Why should it break when hit multiply times?
     
  3. PanzerMeister

    PanzerMeister New Member

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    Dunno, but I'm sure someone said that.
     
  4. Ricky

    Ricky Well-Known Member

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    One shell, no.
    a half-second burst (at 3900 rounds per minute, that is 32 shells - obviously not in the same place, but 32 shells hitting a small area in .5 of a second is gonna do something...) maybe. Definately side/rear...
     
  5. PanzerMeister

    PanzerMeister New Member

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    "Depends on the distance between the tanks, The Chally has a rifled barrel and can engage at a greater distance. Chobham can only take a few hits from any type of round that is why it is bolt on. So if the Chally engages first and scores several hits accurately then bye bye Abrams. At closer ranges it would depend on the skill of the crews.

    IMHO"

    That was GP.
     
  6. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    OMG, thats BULL, in Iraq there where cases (first GO if i'm correct, could be second) where 1 challenger was hit many times and it didn't een have a scratch, if it will break after a few hits the designers did something really wrong! :eek:
     
  7. GP

    GP New Member

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    Sorry but it is true, several penetrator rounds will penetrate Chobham armour, several HE rounds will damage Chobham armour to the extent it is useless. How many rounds I don't know, what country or origin may also have an impact (excuse pun) of the number. Chobham armour is designed to either stop a round by prolonging the impact and therefore reduces the shock of impact or deflecting the explosive charge. When sufficiently damaged it can be changed. Or in peace time removed to make the vehicle lighter.
     
  8. Christian Ankerstjerne

    Christian Ankerstjerne Member

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    Today, the rifled barrel is being phased out. A smooth barrel will mean that the round can travel faster, but in the past alsomeant lost accuracy. Today, however, the fin-stabilized ammunition (APFSDS to mention one of the shorter named ;)) means that accuracy is not lost.

    Christian
     
  9. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    Why would they design a very expensive armor with year and years of research behind it when it is useless after several hits, that doesn't make sence at all!
     
  10. GP

    GP New Member

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    That is not quite it, nothing can be made to withstand impacts from more than one projectile, taking things to extremes if you hit a tank enough times with a hammer you will break it. How many times I don’t know but eventually it will break.

    With armour if it is solid sheet armour if you hit with armour penetrators (dependant on the thickness) will either penetrate or bounce off. HE will provide a shock wave that will travel through the solid metal to the occupants inside. Chobham has best of both worlds (and is a compromise) between stopping AP rounds and deflecting HE rounds. The way to make a tank indestructible is to hollow out a solid chunk of DU and stick everything inside. However, this will be very heavy and no use. Not many tanks can effectively engage a Challenger at distance so not many rounds will successfully hit it. Hence it only needs to protect against a few hits then the damaged armour can be replaced with new. Giving the tank more protection.

    Therefore it does its job and not useless.
     
  11. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    I think when you shoot about 5000 40mm rounds on the frontal armor it still won't break, i'm convinced the 30mm rounds will just bounce off, no damage will be done.

    And that it only needs protection against a few hits is also not true, in a battle you don't know how many times you will get hit, so where did you get this from? And the armor is not easy to replace, its not like the add-on armor on the Leo2a5/a6 or LeClerc...
     
  12. GP

    GP New Member

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    I am not talking 30 mm or 40 mm rounds, but tank and anti tank rounds. These are around the 105 to 120 mm size. If you say that chobham is not easily replaced can you clarify this please.
     
  13. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    I think that the Britsch Challenger has a kind of armor that is welded in one piece, so if there is a hole of 20cm in the frontal armor, they have to replace the whole front armor of the tank. The Leopard2a5/a6 and LeClerc noth have add-on armor packages witch is very easy to replace in the field, a Challenger has to go back to the factory to be repaired.
     
  14. GP

    GP New Member

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    The challenger is armoured using the steel it is made from, they bolt on armour sheets just as the m1 or leopard do. this is Chobham armour and is used to protect the tank. This as is with most tanks can be easily replaced when damaged.

    It has reactive armour panel on the front as well.
     
  15. FNG phpbb3

    FNG phpbb3 New Member

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    Chobham armour is a composite armour with steel on the outside as a solid traditional barrier, and somewhere on the inside a ceramic layer with probably a kevlar or equivalent mesh as well.

    The outer steel acts like traditional armour, the inner ceramic layer shatters on impact to absorb the energy of penetrating shaped charges or solid cores. Technically once shattered the ceramic bit is useless but I don't know how big the pieces are. I suppose two hits very close together could be dangerous.

    I saw an experiment where a bloke shot a hole in a piece of wood with a rifle. Then stuck a generic kitchen tile on it and shot it again. The second time the bullet failed to penetrate or even damage the wood. But the ceramic on the outside by itself would obviously be vulnrable to MG fire.

    As for holes given the design and complexity of modern tanks, if there was a 20 cm hole in the front the engineers would need to replace a lot more than the outer armour! Presumably a lot of the inside electronics, controls, wiring, hydraulics, crew etc would also be damaged. Tanks have come a long way from the Sherman and T34's and probably possess a fair ammount of battlefield critical digital components.

    FNG
     
  16. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    The Leopard2a5/a6 has add-on armor, wich is hallow, thats the v-shaped armor on the front and sides of the turret, behind this is the old A4 armor.

    On tv they showed that there are explosive layers between the Challengers 2 frontal armor.
     
  17. GP

    GP New Member

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    The chanllenger is made using Chobham armour, for added protection it can be fitted with extra plates and reactive armour. This is done during times of war.

    I am not an expert but this is what I have been told by tankies and read.
     
  18. Grieg

    Grieg New Member

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    The Abrams does not use Chobham armor. The armor design was originally based on the Chobham type armor developed by the British however Aberdeen Proving Ground engineers modified and changed it.
    Though the precise make up is classified it is most definitely not bolt-on armor. It can be changed somewhat (though not in the field). Think of it as a depleted uranium box like structure into which different materials can be inserted. (this description refers to frontal armor only).
     
  19. Jeffrey phpbb3

    Jeffrey phpbb3 New Member

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    Who said anything about the Abrams???...

    ANyway, if the DU armor gets hit and they have to replace it it must be done by people with anti-nucleair suits right, and nobody can be near it, so its a bitch to repair...
     
  20. GP

    GP New Member

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    Not quire trueIt is not that radioactive, If you chew big lumps or small lumps over a long period of time it is dangerous. The Challenger is made from Chobham with bolt on sides and frontal reactive armour. It has only been lost to a close range kill from a similar tank so it can't be too bad.
     

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