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Fury (2014)

Discussion in 'WWII Films & TV' started by Deelite, Oct 15, 2014.

  1. Bundesluftwaffe

    Bundesluftwaffe New Member

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    Well they are described as SS so yes, some of those guys were stupid, compared to trained Heer personnell. Also I was a German soldier for a while and can be pretty stupid at times :p
     
  2. Bundesluftwaffe

    Bundesluftwaffe New Member

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    Why does everyone say that, I thought the 2nd part may be better than 1st one..... (the yelling of drill sergeant also got on my nerves btw). Was the marine training really like that ? I would have slapped the sgt. in the face if he yelled at me for longer than 15mins or so. In our unit almost no one was yelling at all....cause not neccessary and dumb. Except of course if someone does stupid things over and over again or you need to yell due to circumstances (unit spread out, alarm etc.)
     
  3. Bundesluftwaffe

    Bundesluftwaffe New Member

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    Tiger 2 is useless, Tiger 1 better but too expensive and man hour intensive too built. From a technical & looks wise point of view, both ok tho. However KT much too heavy for the engine. Probably most know that here, right?

    Btw: Best "tank" movie is called "Bestie Krieg"(The beast:war) , russian T55 lost in A´stan with mad commander :) It´s maybe more action or drama than war but I enjoyed it very much. A
     
  4. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr Patron  

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    I'm glad you're still with us ! Obviously you didn't come across a tank stranded on a path you were hoping to walk down......
     
  5. Bundesluftwaffe

    Bundesluftwaffe New Member

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    Nope I never saw a tank during my time :p I was Luftwaffe radar & anti air guy (improved Hawk)....... But trained for 3 months too as a kind of light infantry (guarding LW installations vs. sabotage and/or air landings - if the hot cold war would run bad for us, we would probably thrown in as cannon fodder too perhaps).

    Which means I know every infantry weapon of the time. But no heavy ones from personal experience I mean. The "heaviest" weapon we probably had was a light Panzerfaust as well the 20mm Flak Zwilling. However there was the mighty Flak Halle, but no Flaks in there. I asked the Uffz guy where are all the guns ? Well they were lent to Turkey probably to be sold to them... lol But it was early 90ties so already a much colder cold war - even if threat from the east still existed. Also remeber our company sergeant was an old "warrior" from Bavaria. He was a champion shooter with Flak 20+40mm at Nato training grounds (Kreta).

    My action if encountering a tank bigger than Panzer I would probably be: If he still moves and shoots - run and hide. If he sits still (immobilzied) and shoots try to get around somehow and try my best with the pz.faust on side/rear..... If it sits still and doesnt shoot, take it home to play around with. However the Faust we had was really the lightest one in existance in the BW and/or Nato. I don´t know if it were a T80 if this one would do harm to it. The heavier Carl Gustav & Faust3 the Heer guys had, probably yes (side shot).

    Btw: The Brits would visit our barracks at times, they were training in the woody/hilly terrain which is so typical of the area it seems. Compared to the flat land in northern Germany where they normally were stationed. Much respect for them, this were real combat troops. And treated their "prisoners" Quite harshly I remember :)
     
  6. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    Large order of chicken wings: Check
    Buttermilk Ranch Sauce: Check
    Chile &Lime Puffed Wheat Snacks: Check
    Newly Released Fury DVD: CHECK!


    Wasn't able to catch this in the theater...
     
  7. Smiley 2.0

    Smiley 2.0 Smiles

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    Sounds like a good time Kodiak ;) I really need to see this movie.
     
  8. A-58

    A-58 Cool Dude Patron  

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    No beer?
     
  9. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member Patron  

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    Enjoy
     
  10. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    Well, I enjoyed the film. It ain't A Bridge Too Far, but it's much better than most of the trash coming out of Hollywood. It could have used a few less cliche's... The girl, Emma, in particular came across as a bit much.

    On a positive note, it's obvious that they went to great lengths to get the kit and weapons right. This is the XIX Corps, and I've run across dozens of accounts of the summary execution of Waffen SS prisoners, so they got that right.

    One inexcusable error is the sobriquet "Roosevelt's Butchers." That name is associated with the 4th Armored Division, not the 2nd.
     
  11. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member Patron  

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    What about the final, climactic scene?
     
  12. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    The final scene? Well, Hollywood, but in building the scene they do disguise Fury as a knocked-out tank so why wouldn't the troops be that close? The Germans are just walking down the road towards a smoking tank. Also, I see complaints about a "frontal assault" but in fact the Germans are almost immediately trying to envelope the tank and do so. Wardaddy even verbalizes this after the initial firefight - watch the sides/rear because that's where they'll come next. They at least try to make sense of the scene...

    But yeah, why expose all your infantry with small arms to a tank at all? In the real world they'd likely back off and hunker down, maybe send in the Faust teams after dark. It's already getting dark...
     
  13. Bundesluftwaffe

    Bundesluftwaffe New Member

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    Why not just let 2-3 guys there to watch the tank (the rest of troops go their merry way) and if anyone wants to leave tank take ém prisoner or shoot em. Why would you risk 50 men to a tank that is immobilized....maybe the main gun is a threat ? Stick a grenade in and let the crew rot......
     
  14. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    The Germans need the road to hit the American flank. They've got vehicles - SPW's, trucks, etc, that they can't leave behind. The situation is very contrived, but not completely unthinkable as it begins. The troops are caught on the road, some fight back and some run for the building for cover. Still, I can't imagine any officer sending in riflemen after that initial contact. You'd pull back until dark and send in the panzerfaust teams.
     
  15. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member Patron  

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    Yeah. It slowly became more ridiculous as the scene unraveled.
     
  16. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    I thought I was looking at a typo, but you're right - the scene didn't unfold, it unraveled... :)
     
  17. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member Patron  

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    :) Lol
     
  18. belasar

    belasar Court Jester Staff Member Patron  

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    I finally broke down and bought my copy this week and watched it, and its bonus features yesterday. Personally, and taken in its entirety, I found it to be a great film. It had some flaws to be sure, but I found nearly all of them forgivable, and those I could not, did not detract from my enjoyment of it.

    About the last battle, a few observations.

    They foreshadowed this in the opening sequence as Wardaddy leaps from the back of a 'apparently' dead Fury to kill a lone German on horseback.

    Not explained in the film to any great degree, but quite common during the last months of the war, was the composition of SS Kampfgruppe's . Often filling their ranks with service and school/training troops of very uneven quality, determined and often fanatical, but lacking the battle smarts of the veterans. I have also read accounts of non SS personnel (Heer, Luftwaffe and even Kreigsmarine) being merged into ad hoc Kampfgruppe's. Throw in a bit of target fixation, battle frenzy prompted by Fury's initial ambush, possible breakdown in command (we only see German orders given as they affect the Fury crew, the focus is on the crew) and the all too natural fog of battle, and this confusion in the German actions become possible. German's might see themselves as supermen, but they never were, and certainly not in April 1945.

    The Panzerfaust's.

    In the marching SS column, one scene cut shows 3 being carried on the shoulder, a second cut I saw another, possibly 2, giving me 4 to 5 visible (that I saw on one viewing at least). Its possible that these men are cut down in the opening ambush and first attempt to storm Fury. We just don't know, but all the main gun ammunition and much of the .30 cal MG ammo is spent here. Making for a spectacular visual if nothing else.

    After the initial firefight we see the SS opening two crates of Panzerfaust's with 4 to 5 in each. We also see/hear a officer exhorting his men to use the effectively, as they are all they have. I recall seeing two fired at Fury, one missing and one hitting, killing "Coon Ass" (the loader). A 50% hit rate isn't too shabby, and if we count the one that took out the 90 day wonder before the Tiger fight, we have a 66% hit rate.

    Just how many were they prepared to use to finish off a already disabled Sherman whose fire is beginning to slack off? Clearly they have more men than effective heavy weapons to spare and a important objective to reach (the American supply column). It is also possible one or more were lost as Fury began to use her last ammunition.

    Don't get me wrong, I have some issues about this sequence, like why did Fury drive over disturbed dirt on the road, that screamed land mine to me as I watched them role over. Why didn't they bring all the .30 cal. inside instead of just some of it. Don't these hatches have any locks on them to prevent somebody just tossing in a grenade? Why wasn't Wardaddy a pink paste inside after two potato mashers have gone off? Why did the SS trooper spare Norman ("Machine") after losing so many men to Fury?
     
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  19. Bundesluftwaffe

    Bundesluftwaffe New Member

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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7t7zfyRDFt0

    Found this "review" (way too short and spoken too fast for a real review imo).

    However I will note 2 things:

    - he says Nazis, not all German soldiers were nazis (note about "reviewer" or general attitude of such films)

    - soldiers look too well groomed and shaved etc. (note about general war movies, he remember 2-3 probably which had guys that looked like they were in the field and fighting, need to find out which ones. - or maybe it was even in hardest combat and fights in rough terrain without much sleep/rest so, that the guys really groomed well and shaved??? Maybe the commanders will look at this but I guess the longer in war, this attitude should decrease and commanders are more keen how the men fight, then how they look - this would deserve a new thread perhaps?? But maybe we have members here who fought and can tell about this topic. I can say, I didn´t care much of looks when in the field for training or better "in the woods" however I was air force so not as much field service as ground troops. In the barracks it was clear that you needed to look ok - shaved, short hair, clolthes in order - but even in training in the field guys tended too look a bit "wilder". I can´t imagine that this wasn´t the case in real war)


    Ha: way better review here:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P5yV2ANepEQ
     
  20. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large Patron  

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    As to the shaving/grooming question. For ground troops in the field it's first a sanitation/hygene issue (modern it's also for field protective mask seal). Depending upon your availability of H2O of course. Drinkin' comes before shaving. You may not get a shower for 45 days, but you try and brush your teeth, wash your hands and face and shave if the water is available. It's also a reflection of discipline. More disciplined, higher morale troops attempt to maintain their military bearing and pride. Eugene Sledge even mentioned this in his "With the Old Breed" book, when he talked about tired, dirty Marines, squaring away their canvas leggings.
     

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