Roel wrote : One would certainly think so. but...surprise Actual author of those quoted passages : Marx's sidekick...Friedrich Engels Surprised?
Actually yes. Seeing as he was mostly famous for his description of English factory and labourer's living conditions... I didn't think of him as a nationalist of the froth-at-the-mouth kind.
not really surprised in terms of the context of the time it would have been written...the mid 19th century. i think at that time it was common ambition of france to have its eastern border fixed to the left bank of the rhine..incorporating german lands west of that line..and france was still the most dominant power on mainland europe at that time. russia was percieved to be threat to all eastern europe hence the reason the ottoman empire was propped up by the other europena powers in that century. the only bit that sounds soemwhat strange is the talk of holy war etc dosnt quite fit in with the ideals of communism?..maybe a communist germany would have been just as dangerous as an imperial or nazi germany?
When I have time to post more I will endeavor to point out other similarities between National Socialism and Communism. It's an area that isn't discussed much since most are willing to buy the line that Nazi's were Fascists and the Soviets were Communists and never the twain shall meet. It's a convenient fiction that allows Leftists to brand Hitler and the Nazi's as right wing and to try to distance themselves from a political philosophy that the entire world condemned.
Ah yes, the poltical spectrum being shaped like a horseshoe. Actually a truism IMO, at least in the practical realm. In Theory (that wonderful Utopia where all ideas work :roll: ), they do have a few more differences than they actually do in practice.
Probably more like a circle, at least in my opinion; both at the extreme right and the extreme left we find anarchy. However, Grieg, I don't think it's strange for any political movement to try to distance themselves from national socialism. Trying to accuse communists of doing so by portraying national socialism as rightist seems overly selective. That the economic system favoured by national socialists was heavily nationalized and socialist (no surprise there) doesn't mean it was the same as other leftist movements, particularly because of its nationalist and racist elements.
Picking up this thread where I left off. Hitler has been characterized by the Left as a Rightist. Lets look at some of Hitler's election pledges:
Well, the poltical spectrum is actually best represtented by a 2D chart, rather than by a line, as you can be a right-winger in your policies on crime/foriengers/etc, but a left-winger in terms of economics. I did know a website that explained this very well and had a wee test you could take to show what you were - but I lost the link. :cry:
I could drag out pages of Hiter's socialist quotes. Communisism and National Socailism are essentially the same- Goebbles need links.
I would never try to defend the Nazi regime in Germany but I would like to bring up the historical frame in which these socialist measures were taken. During the Great Depression and the unbelievable economic malaise that followed it, many people believed that capitalism had failed or was failing; meanwhile in the Soviet Union, Stalin had industrialized his backward country at amazing speed and with amazing results. With all the facts we have now, about the cost to the Soviet people of the industrialization, we can say that it wasn't an inspiring example; but at the time I can imagine that many people saw the communist system as preferrable, or at least more efficient, than capitalism at the time. Therefore many governments, including those of France and Italy, turned to nationalization and sometimes even collectivization to help stop the Depression. This wasn't just a German phenomenon then, and it wasn't a typically Nazi thing either.
The author of which words? The words in the Declaration of Independence were those of Thomas Jefferson who was influenced by the Enlightenment especially John Locke who had a theory of natural law based on life, liberty and estate.
The author of the quote as a whole. Obviously the man was quoting the American Delcaration of Independence and the French Declaration of the Rights of Man, but who was he?
