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How did anybody (British, American, Germans) paratroopers

Discussion in 'WWII General' started by Riter, Feb 16, 2020.

  1. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    roger that....but I would think they would keep the trigger group assembled---or did they not?
     
  2. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    thanks
    ..I've got kids--so no $$$$$ hahahahhaha
    ...yes, seems logical they would keep them together .....we did the same for mortar sights and mortars
    ....
     
  3. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    Correct. Trigger group was not disassembled; just removed.
     
  4. GaryJKennedy

    GaryJKennedy New Member

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    British and Canadian paratroops used an item called a Valise to carry weapons. There were types for rifles, Bren guns and Stens. It used the same principle as the equipment bag (the leg bag that caused US paras so much trouble), which was worn strapped to right leg up to and through exiting the aircraft, then released and lowered down on a tether by the wearer prior to landing. Bag and man landed at the same speed and in the same place, but just a few seconds apart, so sparing the man from landing while actually carrying the load. The valise did the same thing, and allowed a paratrooper to land with his individual weapon close by.

    I'm not sure there was any special means developed to protect optical sights in particular on landing. There were other equally sensitive items dropped with parachute units, such as rangefinders for MMGs and mortars, wireless sets and plenty of things designed to go boom. There were larger containers, dropped separately but still expecting a bump on landing, used for heavier infantry weapons, ammunition, packs and so on.

    Gary
     
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  5. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Gary. Now that makes sense. Considering that the British Commonwealth nations had detachable scope mounts and special carrying cases for the scopes that could also be packed in the valise, it stands to reason they could jump with their sniper rifles. The British mounts were pretty sturdy (unlike the American target scope mounts used by the USMC for their Unertl (which had its own carrying case)).
     
  6. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    ...how hard are they hitting?
    ... I would think the scope, inside it's case, would be packed inside a pack/leg bag/etc with items around it ... .....this would seem adequate protection...?
     
  7. gildman

    gildman New Member

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    Someone brought up the question as to whether these were glider airborne or parachute troops. I think this would be a valid question as it would seemed have been easier to protect a scoped rifle in a glider than in a parachute jump. It is known Brits, US, and Germans all had airborne troops that arrived by gliders.
     
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  8. RichTO90

    RichTO90 Well-Known Member

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    AFAIK the M1C sniper rifle was not authorized in the Airborne Division Parachute or Glider Infantry Regiment until the 1 August 1944 revision of the original February 1942 PIR and GIR T/O&E. At that time one per rifle platoon headquarters was authorized for issue to the "best shot" in the platoon. Prior to that I cannot find any authorization for a "sniper rifle", since the earlier allotment of M1903 rifles was to accommodate the platoon grenadiers, not "snipers". However, even then delays in production of the M1C and the small number completed during the war - 7,971 - limited the actual number issued...the first five were completed in November 1944.

    More of the M1903C were completed - 28,365, beginning in February 1943, but it is unclear how many were ever authorized in the Airborne T/O&E.
     
    Last edited: Jul 16, 2020
  9. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    Without digging out Canfield, what's a M1903C or did you mean M1903A4? TIA.
     
  10. RichTO90

    RichTO90 Well-Known Member

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    Ack! Brainfart. I had 'C' on the brain.
     
  11. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    We all get them. Just don't forget the GF or wife's name.
     
  12. Frank Natoli

    Frank Natoli Member

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    That was true for G43s or K43s [I have one with Walther mount and Voigtlander scope].
    But I do not believe that was true for K98ks, which were the overwhelming majority of German sniper rifles.
    Those scopes had conventional mounts on the receiver and rings.
     
  13. Frank Natoli

    Frank Natoli Member

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    Agree with your elevation zero. By left I presume you mean counter-clockwise.
    Same could not be done for windage, but the M-1 Garand receiver had a series of vertical notches, left to right. Sight base had a single notch, which was above one of the receiver notches. That was your zero, which you would then correct left or right for actual wind.
     
  14. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    The German parachutists had pistols with them and other weapons came in separate metal containers as I remember having read. That was One of the reason why there big losses as the British shot the Germans who were reaching for the heaviest weapons. I guess the glider fallschirmjäger had guns with them but many crashed and soldiers were badly wounded or the gliders also were under direkt fire. One big problem was that the Ju-52s leaving the airfields caused a huge sand cloud and planes had to wait the air to clear before taking off and troops landed later than supposed because the planes gathered together before going towards Crete. So the British were already well Awake and the second German wave was well late too.
     
  15. Riter

    Riter Well-Known Member

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    I need your guys' help in interpretating an 82nd trooper's misadventures in Market Garden.

    He couldn't have been thinking of jumping with his rifle in his hands, could he? That scope was not durable and could break or gete jarred. Additionally you need your hands on the riser and yank up right before you land to soften the landing (in college I jumped 5X). Could he have had the 03A4 in a modified Griswold bag but with burnt hands how does he release it?
     

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