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Intelligence rec'd by Nagumo prior to Pearl Harbor attack

Discussion in 'Pearl Harbor' started by DogFather, Jun 24, 2010.

  1. DogFather

    DogFather Member

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    What was the info obtained by Adm Chuichi Nagumo, during the last 12 hours or so, before the PH attack?

    Two sources, I have found say about the same thing (I now feel I need two sources, due to my lack of credibility, according to a few, but very vocal members on this forum).

    http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,871891,00.html

    Japanese spy, Vice Consul Morimura (his real name was Takeo Yoshikawa), sent this from Pearl Harbor to Toyko, the night of Dec. 6, 1941.

    VESSELS MOORED IN HARBOR: NINE BATTLESHIPS; THREE CLASS-B CRUISERS; THREE SEAPLANE TENDERS; SEVENTEEN DESTROYERS. ENTERING HARBOR ARE FOUR CLASS-B CRUISERS; THREE DESTROYERS. ALL AIRCRAFT CARRIERS AND HEAVY CRUISERS HAVE DEPARTED HARBOR. No INDICATION OF ANY CHANGES IN U.S. FLEET.

    2nd source::// ibiblio.org/pha/timeline/411206cx2.html, says the same thing, but adds, it appears that no air reconnaissance is being conducted by the fleet air arm (which would be useful info).

    Time says, this was the "last word required by Nagumo before mounting the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor", but my question was it the last
    intelligence, Nagumo was able to get. On another forum, claims are made that subs were giving him info and that Nagumo sent out scout planes,
    before launching the first wave of planes, which also gave him info.

    If accurate, how did they communicate, if strick radio silence was being
    adhered to?
     
  2. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    DF, you can listen without sending. Sheesh.
     
  3. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

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    As OP so patiently tried to point out, turning on your radio in your house and listening to the tunes or the news doesn't give away where your house is does it? Receiving incoming radio signals is completely in accord with "radio silence". Replying to same would be a breach of said policy, Nagumo didn't reply. He took in the latest data and continued on his mission.
     
  4. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    They took silence seriously. The radio keys on the ships were removed and locked in the ships' safes. The keys on the scout planes were jammed open with paper. (The scout plane radios would be needed if an enemy force was located in a threat posture.)

    "The fate of the empire depends on you!" And then some maroons think they broadcast? :mad: The Japanese are NOT as stupid as CTers seem to think. The racist attitude is very clear in that type of thing, I believe.
     
  5. DogFather

    DogFather Member

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    I was just wondering if radio signals were sent from scout planes, or Jap subs, back to Nagumo and the Jap strike force. Wouldn't that have been
    also picked up by a US Army/Navy listening post at PH.

    No conspiracy or racist attitude involved.
     
  6. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    I covered that. Read the thread.

    And, again, you have produced a classic conspiracy theorist post. No more whinging about that.
     
  7. DogFather

    DogFather Member

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    But how was the "latest data" sent to Nagumo? Did Naguno get any info
    from scout planes and subs in the PH area...simple question.

    Naguma wouldn't have been the only one able to pick-up a radio signal.
    So, I would think, scouting planes or subs, would be reluctant to send a
    radio message.

    Did the scout planes, just not report, which meant something, or did they
    return with a scouting report?
     
  8. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    Ever intercept a ciphered morse code message? How much of it could you read?

    "Hey, you Japanese carriers 3 degrees west of north, ~250 miles away, this is your scout plane! Come on down and bomb the snot out of Pearl Harbor."

    Yeah, that happened. The unrealistic nature of CT is the worst part for me.
     
  9. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    Have we stooped down to a level where we answer questions with sarcasm. I do not see any conspiracy theorist question here. I see him asking what sources of information were used to (if any) keep Nagumo informed. There may be something I am missing but as far as this thread is concerned, it is a valid posting. Hopefully someone will chime in with some quality answers
     
  10. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

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    The latest report was sent by the "on sight" spy in the Japanese embassy, he sent the last "data" on the ships in the harbor in the "Purple" diplomatic code. We had broken and did intercept this message, unfortunately it wasn't decyrpted until Dec. 8th the following day after the attack.
     
  11. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    So far DF has posted nothing but conspiracy theory here. The questions he asks are classic CT. And he doesn't read the material provided, he doesn't respond to questions, he doesn't provide sources. That doesn't leave us much except exasperation.
     
  12. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    You see all this in this thread?
     
  13. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    As pointed out elsewhere, it's a pattern DF has shown in this forum. He's resolute in ignoring information provided him, requests for sources, and any need to read more than one or two conspiracy theorists' books.
     
  14. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    I'm addressing the thread in question. There are other rogues who have 'patterns' but are all of their postings automatically thrown out? My question stands, is the thread in question invalid?
     
  15. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    He's been challenged. It did no good. This won't go on much longer, I think.
     
  16. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    You have not answered my question. Is the question asking about radio intel available invalid?
     
  17. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    It's a "have you stopped beating your wife" question. In isolation, not a problem. We've given DF sources that would answer his question nicely, but he won't read them. Not much left at this point.
     
  18. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    I do not see any sources referenced in this thread
     
  19. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    I do get tired of copy and pasting them for DF. However, they're in my sig if you'd like to peruse them?
     
  20. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    That was neither mentioned nor referenced in this thread.
     

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