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Looking to get started on researching Grandfather...need some tips/help

Discussion in 'Military Service Records & Genealogical Research' started by Bostonfan, Mar 14, 2010.

  1. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Hi everyone...I was hoping to get some tips/help/guidance/info on researching my grandfather's service in wwii.

    I can give the info I do know and why I think it may make my research a little tricky. My grandfather, John E. Patterson, registered for the Marines at 16 and lied about his age to the recruiter. I think he eventually got caught and his mother signed off to let him join but I don't know how this would affect any service records or searches. My father believes he served with the 1st Marine Division but we do know he spent 48 months in the Pacific Arena. I know a little about where he served (he definitely participated in both the battle of Guadalcanal and Guam....am unsure of which others)

    I don't know any personal stories other than one. One of the Marines he served with was Peter Brooks Saltonstall, the son of the then Massachusetts governor (and later Senator) Leverett Saltonstall. Peter Saltonstall was killed by a sniper when on a patrol with my grandfather and several other Marines. My grandfather was the only Marine from the patrol who survived and Leverett Saltonstall was able to get this information and contacted my grandfather when he returned. This started a relationship between the two that lasted for the rest of Senator Saltonstall's life.

    I have one picture of my grandfather from some point in the war (I'm not sure). He's standing in front of his house in West Roxbury, Ma. I will attach it here:

    [​IMG]

    I'd love to get any tips or feedback on how to proceed. I've seen how to request his service records but I'm not sure how accurate they may be considering he had lied when he initially registered. Any help is greatly appreciated.
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
  2. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Quick update:

    Located his discharge papers. Under Battles, engagements, skirmishes, expeditions it lists only "22 Jul to 10 Aug 44 participated in action against the enemy on Guam, Mariana, Islands." Is this the entire record of any battle he would have participated in?

    Next to service it lists "27 Sep 42 to 19 Feb 45 New Caledonia, New Zealand and Marianas, and British Solomon Islands"

    There is a serial number listed. "344630" but it appears next to the signature of a Lieutenant Colonel. Would that be his or the Lt. Col.?
     
  3. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    He never talked about his experiences and much of what we know or thought we knew, I don't think really came directly from him.
     
  4. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    I would go ahead and request the records. I don't think his age would have any influence on the completeness of his records. If you can scan his discharge papers, we might be able to give you more help.

    Good luck.
     
  5. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Any help is amazing. I know my grandmother has a box of letters he had sent his mother while overseas. She has pledged to look at some point but maybe if I come with other research she will renew her looking.

    I will scan and upload the discharge papers tomorrow. Thanks for even reading!
     
  6. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    No problem. This kind of research is something I enjoy doing. I look forward to those scans.
     
  7. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    The discharge papers I have is just one sheet....double sided. Scanned both sides and hopefully can successfully attach them here. Thanks for any info you can garner from these.

    I'm also starting the process (which seems easy, just have to get my father involved it looks like) of requesting his service records. I'd love to find the letters he had sent his mother, I know they are somewhere. If people other than me are interested, I can post anything I learn from it all.
     

    Attached Files:

  8. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    Based on what I can see here, he would have been entitled to the Asiatic-Pacific Campaign Ribbon, with one battle star. The battle star would be for the Marianas Campaign, of which Guam was part. Read more about the Marianas here Mariana Islands Campaign and the Great Turkey Shoot | World War II Database

    Here is a link to the ribbon information Asiatic Pacific Campaign Medal - WWII Ribbon (Model #:440 ARPCMR)
    He also would have been eligible for the World War II Victory Medal, probably a Good Conduct Medal and a "Ruptured Duck" for his discharge.
    [​IMG]
    Good Conduct - Marines

    [​IMG]

    WW2 Victory Medal

    [​IMG]

    Honorable Discharge Pin

    Hope this helps.
     
  9. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    That's an awesome start, thanks so much! I know it may be too hard to see but would those be any of the medals pinned on his chest.

    My next step is definitely to look into a records request and see what I can gather. From there...who knows? I might post here whenever I get that, especially if I can't decode all of it!

    Thanks again for the info...invaluable!
     
  10. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    Most likely, the medal would not be on the uniform. Instead, each medal came with a ribbon that mirrored the colors of the award. That would go on the uniform. Here's the link to the Marine Corps Ribbons. U.S. Marine Corps Ribbons/Awards

    If you have any pictures, scan them and post them. We'll do what we can. In any case, post whatever you find. We are all interested in our heritages.
     
  11. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Okay, we've just found a "treasure trove" of stuff. Hundreds of pictures, including an album that he labeled and captioned.

    On the front of this album he has two patches taped on. One is a blue patch with a red number 1 with "guadalcanal" written in it and some white stars around. The other is a red patch with a golden dragon and a roman numeral III at the top.

    The album has a plethora of pictures. Lots of dead Japanese soldiers (many gruesome), a couple of some Japanese POW's and lots of marines around. Most of these seem to be from Guam according to how they are labeled. He has some Japanese booklets and paper and what appears to be a letter written to a Japanese soldier. (Or so I would guess). It turns out my grandfather wrote poetry during his time, a lot of which appears to be quite angry. One must have been published by a military publication entitled "V-mail Chopbeat", a poem mocking V-mail. Others don't have his name but I assume he wrote, a quick Google search did not turn anything up. There is so much more in the scrapbook, I could go in detail about if others were interested or start a thread in a more appropriate forum.

    Another exciting find was something titled "Service Album". It is soft leather bound with a pictur of soldiers storming a beach on the bottom right. In one part it says "Platoon 263 Parris Island S.C. Dec. 1941". I assume this was time in boot camp. On the left side of the cover, it is harder to make out. The top is the Marine symbol and Semper Fidelis written above. Beneath, as best I can read is written (part is completely undecipherable):

    "3rd
    4th Barrage Ball(undecipherable then) Squdns.
    ------------------------------
    1st Base Depot
    ------------------------------
    Battery A
    1st 135mm Artillery B."

    Then around the cover is written (question marks where I can't make it out entirely) "Samoa-New Caledonia-New Hebrides-New Zealand-Guadalcanal-Tulagri(?)-Cniwetok(?)-Kwazeleny(?)-Guam"

    Inside are more photos, these mostly of family and friends both in and out of the service. Also several pages with a printed "Autographs and Friends" template are the names, addresses and messages from a good 43 other Marines.

    All in all, amazing stuff. I can share more certainly or in another forum if that is where I would find interested peoples. Thanks for even reading!
     
  12. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Made out two of the places I couldn't before from a log in the service album that I hadn't noticed before. The log, as he has filled it out under cruising record makes it appear he went from Guadalcanal to Eniwetok and then from Eniwetok to Kwatelein and from Kwateleing to Guam. Would this make sense?
     
  13. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    Is this one of the patches?
    [​IMG]

    If so, it's the 3rd Marine Amphibious Division.


    Is this the other?
    [​IMG]

    1st Marine Division - Theater made patch
    WWII US Military Patches Price Guide - MilitaryItems.com

    By the way, the correct spelling is Kwajalein.

    I'll check some other things tomorrow.
     
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  14. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Those are exactly the patches. Would he have switched divisions at some point?

    Thanks for any info you can give! It's fascinating just looking this personal histoey of the war, moreso given that it is my grandfathers.
     
  15. Bostonfan

    Bostonfan Member

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    Recently, in large part inspired by The Pacific, I started looking into my Grandfather's war history. He unfortunately passed away six years ago and even late into life, did not talk much about his experiences. The little I knew was that he dropped out of high school in 1941 at 16, lied about his age and joined the Marine Corps. This past weekend my father and I discovered a bag and several envelopes filled with various memoribillia.

    The biggest finds were two albums. One appears to be a chronicle of sorts of my grandfather's service during the Battle of Guam. There are lots of pictures of dead Japanese soldiers (many gruesome) and labeled, also I'm assuming pictures of Japanese POW'S. Picture of Marines, his buddies as labeled, are also throughout. There is Japanese memoribilia, I'm guessing lifted from dead soldiers, including what appears to be a personal letter. There is various other memoribillia sprinkled throughout as well, including many pictures of topless naked girls (and who can blame a teenage boy for obsessively taking photos of this!). His sense of humor comes through in many captions and also a budding sense of poetry. His poems seem darker and angrier, the only one I know came from him was one titled "V-Mail Chopbeat" and must have been printed by some military publication. There's another, I assume he wrote but did not sign, called "Our Fighting Men" which is a sarcastic poem about the Army landing on Guadalcanal after the Marines had been there. And another angry poem about people celebrating V-Day while he was still in the Pacific. The cover of this has two patches, which LRusso helped me identify in the Research forum, one is a First Marine Division theater made patch with Guadalcanal in a number 1. The other is the 3rd Marine Amphibious Division patch. Not sure why he had both.

    The second album is a leather bound album with a soft leather cover titled "Service Album" with a picture of soldiers storming a beach on the bottom right. He has his name "Pfc. John E. Patterson" on the bottom and above the picture he wrote "Platoon 263 Parris Island Dec. 1941" He also listed, what I'm guessing are the places he visited along the cover. In order he has "Samoa-New Caledonia-New Hebridies-New Zealand-Guadalcanal-Tulagri-Eniwetok-Kwajelein-Guam" He has written also on the cover things I am not sure what they are, but I guess have something to do with his division or service. Some of it is indecipherable but as best I can see it says:

    "3rd
    4th Barrage Ballon(this is guess, it is indecipherable) Squdns.
    5th
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    1st Base Depot
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Battery A
    1st 155 MM Artillery Bn"

    Inside this album is several pages containing names, addresses and notes from men he was serving with. Then a cruising record that lists:

    Weighted Anchor Dropped
    Guadalcanal Eniwetok
    Eniwetok Kwajelein
    Kwajelein Guam

    Following this are scores of pictures, many of him at home with family. But also many casual pictures of him and buddies at rest in the Pacific somewhere. Cool stuff.

    The envelopes have more memoribilia, letters he received from girls back home and hundreds more pictures. All in all, really cool stuff. It's been a fascinating look back. The stuff has far too much sentimental value to give away but I could scan some pictures here if there is interest (or at least try, this might be difficult) or describe some of it in more detail, again if there is interest.

    Thanks for reading.
     
  16. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Any photos or other documents that you want us to see, please feel free to post them.

    If you need assistance, please contact any the moderators or Pacific area trustees.
     
  17. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    I'm wondering whether he served part of his time in a barrage balloon squadron. They were deactivated in 1943, and the men reassigned. I say this because the Barrage Balloon unit patch is similar to the Guadalcanal patch you have.
    [​IMG]


    Check this site for a slide show on Marine Barrage Balloon units (about 2/3 down the page) Skylighters: An Introduction to Antiaircraft Artillery and Searchlights

    My guess, and it's only that, is that he was originally in the 3rd Marines in a kind of skylighter unit, then when they were de-activated he was transferred to the 1st Marines. I'm taking that guess from the statement of 1st Base Depot, and then into the 1st Marines Artillery. I hope one of our Marine experts weighs in here.

    Good luck, and by all means post any pictures of items you have.
     
  18. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    Bostonfan, I merged these two threads since they are after the same information. It's easier for other to answer questions if everything is in one place.
     
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  19. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Isn't this the III Marine Amphibious Corps?

    He very likely could have switched units, it was not all uncommon, for any number of reasons.

    FYI -
    A Division is a fixed-structure, self-contained formation of +/-10,000-20,000 men, that provides command and logisitical support for the members of the division. It can function on it's own, providing most combat needs from within it's established, standardized configuration.

    A Corps is flexible formation, really just an HQ and some support units, that provides operational command of a group of units, such as divisions and smaller units. The composition of a corps changes as needs change and it will have various units attached and detached to accomodate changing combat needs.

    In the command structure, a corps falls between army (not the Army, but numbered armies, such as 7th Army) and the divisions. Armies command Corps, Corps command Divisions and smaller units. The size of armies and corps changed regularly (sometimes daily), while the compositoin of units below that level were fixed by the Table of Organization and Elements setup for the particular type of unit.
     
  20. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member

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    Mea culpa. You are, of course, correct. The site I found the patch on listed it as a Division. The roman numerals should have tipped me off that it was a Corps.
     

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