Luftwaffe Stukas on Ost front and elsewhere....

Guys been in a little nice discussion with author and night ground attack expert, Nick Beale from the UK. Nick published the beautiful and well researched book on NSGr 9 covering the unti in Italy. We had been discussing for some time the Ju 87 night groundt attack units on the east and western fronts, and the Ju 87 D was mentioned more than once and many books make it clear that the variant D-7 and D-8 were flown. This is just not the case The earlier D-1's and D-3(N) and D-5(N) were flown, so the latter must have been retrofitted with the flame dampners and flash hiders for it's two 2cm weapons and the rear twin mg 81's. dive brakes were removed. It is also interesting till war's end in the east that the Latvian contingent with their own a/f night staffels used bi-planes, slow but very effective like the Soviets night harrassment a/c

E

 

Did they say why the Ju-87 was chosen for this type of work as opposed to a FW-190 or Henschel 123 ?
What did they do when they thought they saw something on the ground, drop flares?

Did they lose many people from pilots getting disorented at night while manuvering about. ( there is a word for this but I can't recall it now )
Did they carry a 2nd crew member since you said they removed the rear gun ?

Did the aircraft fly alone or in groups ?

Just thought of the word !!!!! Vertigo

 

Tank :

Boy I could write a whole big chapter on this as I have been interested in this night ground attack engagements since 1969.....
The Hs 123 was outdated by 1944 and only eastern front units on a small scale still used the a/c. The Ju 87D's were more suited with a good forward firing platform, good visibility, a godd diving a/c, a second crew member with the twin mg 81's that I was talking about, and a slow enough speed where the crew could take their time to set up the attack and perform it and hopefully avoid heavy flak defences and retreat.
The Fw 190F's and G's were pretty much sent to the Day time ground attack units and especially used on the ost front where the panzerblitz rockets were quite effective against Soviet armor. Yes some were even issued to western front units, not so much the rocket equipped Fw's as the bomb dropping ones. Since there was a lack of night Fw 190's it was not till 1945 that they were issued to only a selct few. The Ju 87D's were standard after going through several earlier bi-plane types and even some Italian a/c with NSGr 9.
Because the Ju 87 pilot's homed in on centers of communication/railroads and road crossings, there was usaully traffic traveling with their lights on and the German pilots were able to view this and attack. No flares were dropped by these low flying and slow a/c and it was all done visually.
The Ju 87 crews had much expereince already by flying the older bi-plane types so accidents were not that common in the air, there were of course landing accidents and especially if the airfield had been bombed, craters had to be negotiated.....uk !
Yes there was a second crew member to operate the radio for communication purposes as well as for rear defence with the twin .30's.
From what I have read in documents and the P-61 9th air force combat reprots in 1945, the Stukas of NSGR 1 and 2 would fly generally in 3's, and then when the targets were selected would bank off individually to attack and watch and return if possible with strafing with their two 20mm guns. Flak......light 20mm and .50 cal was the biggest concern of the night Ju 87's although the P-61's and Mosquito intruders were starting to be of concern from February 1945 onward. A real problem in catching the Ju 87 D's was their terribly slow speed was an advantage to the German's. The 425th nfs P-61 commander Gilly Lewis told me he came behind three Ju 87's so fast, and applied the brakes so to speak, was about ready to arm his wepaons and he shot past them, he banked around and lost the three Stuak's in the ground haze.....

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Thanks Erich for the information ! I always like learning more about the Luftwaffe in general but I like the rare ideas and designs that they came up with during the course of the war. I was watching the history channel the other night and they were showing how the Germans were working on an infra-red based fire control system.

It seems to me a contridiction since the 1940's German is portrayed as a very straight,conservative,stern type person and yet they came out with all of these highly advanced aircraft designs that were decades ahead of everyone else. It just seems like the German culture would have been the worse culture for such advanced designers to fluroush, but they did anyhow.

Too bad they could not round up all of them and send them to the Lockheed Skunkworks at the end of the war.

 

Ta 152, save your monies and order the NSGr 9 book by Nick Beale through Classic Publications in the UK. They have an east coast distributor and the book is around $ 50.00 US or less with shipping included in that price. Some very unusual looking a/c first used by this unit until the complete overhaul with the Ju 87D. Beautiful profiles and some good material on tactics. A complete losses roster is included within the text. A must have if you are interested in the Ju 87 Stuka.

E

 

seemed like a good ol thread to bring up again since Kai brought up Stukas and Hawks

hey Ta did you ever purchase the NSGr 9 book...........anyone else ? a neat book filled with first hand and quite rare info on a nocturnal ground attack unit with most time spent in the ETO and later in the Reich.

it's snowing here finally today........... YES