Discussion in 'World War 2' started by Boba Nette, Jan 12, 2006.
Why did some nations wait till the last months of WWII to declare war on Germany?
they saw the winning side, allies!!!!
For some of them I imagine this is true.
another reason is: "hey the war is almost over. if we join the allies now, we won't be loosing any troops and still say that we did our bit"
And some wait until the last six months of a war to enter it and try to claim they were the ones who won.
some people are so low
Diplomatic opportunism isn't necessarily wrong. After all, at least they did do their part in the end, they didn't sit it through staying neutral.
Although in most cases the 'help' was not offered when needed, and was not needed when offered.
Having said that, countries such as Brazil did send fighting troops (to Italy in Brazil's case) who did a good job.
But I agree, it is diplomatic opportunism, and as such is a long-known feature of international relations. Throughout WW2 Germany spent a lot of effort trying to persuade Turkey to join her side. Turkey (probably remembering WW1) dithered, despite the early German successes, and is probably very glad that it did so.
Intresting info on the colours codes for US Pre WW2 plans - given how having possesion of the Azores would be helpful in the Battle of the Atlantic, i'd love to see how Warplan Grey was updated, it wasn't until late 1943 that Portugal's leader allowed the US and UK to base aircraft there and I've read recently somewhere even then RAF aircraft had US markings.
Colors used to designate nations in US pre-WWII War Plans:
Blue: United States (as a belligerent)
Garnet: New Zealand
Purple: Soviet Union
Red: Great Britain
Violet: China (intervention in internal matters)
White: United States domestic enemy (communist putsch, etc)
Yellow: China (international conflict)
"Rainbow": War plans developed starting in 1939 that involved the US as part of a multi-national alliance against the Axis powers. The Rainbow Plan went through five different versions before the US entered the war, and Rainbow Five was the blueprint for the Allied victory, containing many elements from the latest versions of War Plan Orange and War Plan Black.
These colors were used to designate a nation for war planning purposes, but the assignment of a color plan to a nation did not necessarily mean that there was a plan for the US to go to war against that nation; it might just indicate that the nation in question was somehow involved in a US strategy. In some cases the war plan was clearly to meet the threat of a potential enemy, while in other cases it involved assisting an ally or a nation the US considered strategically vital to keep out of the hands of an enemy. War Plan Orange, for example, was the plan to mount a cross-Pacific offensive to contain Japanese aggression, while War Plan Indigo was the consensual occupation of Iceland in the case of Denmark being defeated by a nation that was considered unfriendly to the US. War Plan Crimson was a US invasion of Canada, not because Canada was considered a threat, but rather to deny Canadian ports to British forces should the US find itself at war with an unfriendly UK. War Plan Lemon involved US options to assist Portugal should they be invaded by a hostile Spain, and War Plan Gray involved the US occupation of the Azores should Portugal be overrun. War Plans Yellow and Brown involved US assistance to China and Indonesia in the case of an attack by Japan.
These plans were first drawn up soon after the Spanish-American War, and updated (or radically changed) periodically as technology or the world situation changed. At various times different plans were considered to be more pertinent than others: for example, in the early years of the 20th century the US fought a war against Spain and intervened several times in Mexico, so War Plans Lemon, Green, Olive, and Tan would have been considered more important in 1914 than those same plans would have been in the 1930s, while War Plan Garnet probably began as part of a grand strategy involving war against the British Empire but ended up as a plan to assist New Zealand in the case of a Pacific offensive by the Japanese. Conversely, War Plan Silver began as a study of US options with Italy as an ally intervening in a Latin American crisis, but would have changed into a hostile plan against Italy after the Fascist takeover and the alliance with Germany.
Now for Chrisitan and Roel when you read this, this is the way to make a point; this is not conjecture this is based on fact and source is provided. This is an excellent post by the person directly above, nice work!
Christian and Roel, when making a counter claim to a post this is how to supply your facts/source to your material. If you bioth think I am picking on you then you are right, hopefully you are mature enough to see it's for a greater good.
I would like you to direct me to a non-factual post I've made, where I have claimed otherwise, and where I have failed to present sources when requested.
Regarding the post above, thefar majority is a direct copy of the website mentioned, and thus doesn't give any merit to the author of the post. Furthermore, the website mentioned doesn't mention its sources, so the information is impossible to verify (and its value as a source is therefore nil).
It would be very easy to set up a website mentioning no sources, and writing whatever you would like to emphasis in various discussions.
I don't really understand why you bring it up here.
Look, it is likely that, if it is that in-depth, that the US Government, in whatever branch it may be, has come up with it. If it were a normal person like, not meaning to pick sides, you say it is, then they wouldn't have bothered to mention a plan for Mexico, Ireland or Cuba, they would have focused on the major fighting forces (US, Germany, USSR, Japan).
As for the original question, I agree with the apparent concensus that countries that join late in the war are able to say that they 'did their part' yet lost few troops. They did, and they did.
some were even forced by the Russians, like Bulgaria and Roumenia.
i think that only turky and ireland stayed completely neutral the whole war. the irish president (or was it prime minister) was even the first politcian to sign the morning register of hitler, in the german ambassy in dublin. he felt that it was his duty as a neutral statesman to send his condolencens, even to a dictator.
Lets see (searching, searching):
1 March 1945: Turkey declares war on Germany and Japan.
Not meaning to be offensive. I think you are right about Ireland, though
And Switzerland, and Sweden, and... :grin:
Greenland and that would be it, i think
hey, i didn't know Turkey declared war against germany. i keep on learning stuff every day on this site
Greenland is a part of Denmark which was occupied by the Germans.
Did this actually have consequences for Greenland itself by the way?
not that i can remember. i also wonder what happend to the far-oer (that island group between the orkneys and Iceland). did the allies used it as an naval base or an airfield or so??
Iceland was also Danish - but declared itself neutral. Until us Brits went and occupied it.