Greetings all - Well, what with all of the holiday behind us, I am now at liberty to get some more topics posted here with pics. I have got in touch with Stevin, and am going to send him the photographs of the U.S. Airborne jump jacket that I took shots of week before last. Once these are posted here, I will then go about describing what my friend so graciously allowed us to take shots of for us to look at, and converse about here. Bill
I'm also looking forward to seeing this jacket. I'm not knowledgable on US items--cept for the Helmet and weapons.
Without further ado. Sorry for the delay, Bill. [ 11. July 2003, 05:38 AM: Message edited by: Stevin Oudshoorn ]
Thank you for posting the digitals Stevin. Very much appreciated. A couple of weeks ago, a friend of mine was gracious enough to drive up to my home, and allow me to photograph a couple of items out of his collection. This U.S. Airborne jump jacket, and a tunic and cap set from a crew member of the U-564. The U boat grouping will be coming up soon, but first, let me briefly describe what I know of this U.S. grouping which, I am sorry to say, might not be as much as I would like as Allied material is not my strength. Doc, if you, or any other forum member who does concentrate more on this area, would like to chime in, please, feel free to do so, as that is what this forum is about. To share, to learn, and to understand as much as we can about World War II history. Ok, enough said on that. This jump jacket was manufactured in 1942. It was issued to U.S. Airborne troops as their main style of jump jacket, and was used during the jump on Normandy. The upper pockets are slanted, and what my friend, and owner is intending to do on the last shoot is to show one where the location of the jump knife would go in order to assist a paratrooper to free himself from tangled shroud lines if he possibly found himself caught up in his risers in a most unfortunate situation. For those of you who might not know it, the U.S. paratroopers had a "gravity knife" of sorts as well. Maybe not as historically glamorous as its German counter part, but it did exist none the less. The U.S. M-1 steel pot is not actually a paratroop version as the chinstrap assemply is standard infantry, etc., but the owner informs me that the only difference between this one pictured and an actual paratroop version is the chinstrap assembly, a difference that could cost the potential owner of one hundreds of dollars. The canteen and ammo pouches I assume are also standard U.S. issue for all troops, but maybe I am wrong. ( My cat got to playing with my notes, and digested a portion of them. Lack of fiber maybe!? I am therefore running on memory, which, at my age, sometimes fades in and out these days! ) In today's collecting arena, I was told by the owner that this jacket, of this style, in this condition would set one back $600. Anyone wish, or able to comment further on this nice set up of U.S. Airborne gear? Be good to each other. Bill
Sorry fellows - I also meant to further add that yes, the grenade is an original U.S. "pineapple" fragmentation grenade, inert, with powder and charges deleted. Apparently this is a fairly fine example to have as these are getting tougher to locate in today's market place. Also, the back pack is of a style favored by U.S. paratroopers of the time as well. I believe the date on the pack is 1942 or 1943 as the ink stamp was slightly faded. Bill
It's also, as I understand, pretty rough to find one of these with the belt still attached to it. I guess the paratroopers usually got rid of the thing!
Doc - When you are doing your living history there in your area, do you see many of these guys reenacting as U.S. para's? Do you do it yourself? How common are these jump jackets, and do you think $600 for an original is too expensive, just about right, or inexpensive? I am curious, because I have always been told, correctly or incorrectly that U.S. gear is lots cheaper than let's say German, or Japanese. $600 on a jump jacket though seems to be approaching the costs of some of the original German tunics. Bill
US reenactors are obsessed with airborne. Every reenactor seems to do airborne, ranger, or Fssf. In all honesty, I'd say people doing airborne impressions are more common than people doing the average GI. For the most part, US stuff is really cheap. But US Airborne is really an obsession. If you can find the service number written in the jacket (The first letter of the man's last man, a dash, and the last 4 numbers of his serial number) prices increase dramatically on jump jackets. Same with if they have any original patches or even if you can tell from a shadow what unit he might have been. I've seen jackets with the patches and number inside go for around $3,000. So, yeah, I'd say it's worth $600, though I really don't collect airborne stuff as I can't afford it!
Great US setup you have there Bill. Ah--only to see it on Errol Flynn--and he carrying his M1-Carbine with Paratrooper stock. Serious though---US stuff--what ive seen was always much much cheaper than German stuff. But--over at www.blackcrossmilitaria.com they have a ww2 helmet with the division insignia painted on it--they want I think $400.00 for it and I think its got a fixed-bale chinstrap system--but don't take my word for it--I only glanced at it for a few seconds. Bill--they had a 7 place ww1 & ww2 Luftwaffe Ribbon bar--THE only large Lw bar I have seen in about 4 years--but was sold long before I saw it or i'd bought it. [ 12. July 2003, 04:25 PM: Message edited by: C.Evans ]
Doc - The friend of mine who owns this set up, located one previously at a garage sale in Portland, Oregon for $5!!!!! Thinking it might be worth something, he took it to a militaria show there, and had three guys lining up for the jacket. The first guy mulled it over, offered my friend $500, and he took it figuring he really made a killing. Then, after seeing the Band Of Brothers, and having met the guys at a fund raising event in Longview, Washington of all places ( Bill Guarnier, Moe Alley, Earl "One Lung" McClung, Don Malarkey, Buck Compton, etc. ) he decides to go out and sell off some of his German collection to drum up funds to purchase U.S. Airborne. This jacket is one of his finds, but at $100 more than the one he found for $5, and that one was in better condition! Carl - Thanks for the heads up on the Luftwaffe ribbon bar, but I just spent a bundle. Picked up those eight Iron Crosses from Joerg, and that just about did me in. Again thanks any way. Bill
No problem Bill--it was sold before I found it but--I woulda snatched it in a heartbeat if it had not been taken already. It'd be THE only ribbon bar I had w/ the LW long service adler device but--as is ALWAYS my luck--it was sold long before I saw it
thought I would point out after WW2, no gravity knives were further issued to airborne units. Also, there is a repro (real good) airborne outfit (jacket&pants) on sale for about $225 or you can check at 1-800-962-7688 for details. Also, some personnel strapped a carbine bayonet to their boot, for emergencies...... just for info. [ 15. July 2003, 07:32 PM: Message edited by: 187th Airborne ]
Hello 187th - First of all, welcome to the forum. I appreciate your willingness to give us a look see. Hope you enjoy your stay here. Secondly, thank you for pointing out that after World War II, no gravity knives were issued to U.S. Airborne forces. Much appreciated. This is what we want the militaria section of the forum to become, to be an arena in which all of our members can learn and grow through educational aspects offered up by others. Again, thank you. Bill
Thanks for sharing this, Bill. It was the 82nd Airborne that first got me into researching WW2 and writing to vets at age 15. I was dying to own a jacket like this. At that time I never even saw them for sale. Originals that is. I did get a extensive package with information from a US company which made repro's and did a very good job. Even sent me a sample of the material they used. Never bought one as my parttime job could really come up with that kinda money. You could buy the whole suit there, except the jump boots. How difficult are those to get? Somebody knows? This is a beautiful example, Bill. I have no idea about US militaria prices. I just don't see them advertised where I live. 187th Airborne, also welcome to the forums! Hope to see you here often.
jump boots are still on the commercial market, but in BLACK not brown. The brown shoe Army (Ikejacket) went out in 1958, when the Army went to Green uniform and black shoes. Orig. brown jumps boots would be dear, if found. Cheers
Not to be a smart ass, but I found 2 pairs of WWII jump boots at a flea-market for $4 a pair!!! Repro boots and uniforms are very easy to find, but are also really expensive in thier own right - even when they are sold used by reenactors on ebay. www.wwiiimpressions.com has them, and I think maybe www.atthefront.com does as well. I think there are at least 4 places that make them now a days.
Hey guys, On eBay there is a gentleman selling a brand new M42 Jump jacket and pants. They are dated Aug 9 43. The price right now is 2000.00. Any takers?
Hello Steve - Although not a U.S. militaria collector as stated previously, it would seem to me that $2,000 U.S. for even an original August 1942 dated jump jacket and trousers would be just a bit too much to pay, wouldn't it? I would assume, and I stress, ASSUME, that around half that amount would be more of a real world price, would it not? Hello Doc - Listen, even though I am not an Allied militaria collector, your boots at $4 a pair seems to be a good investment! Tell you what, I'll triple your money, and offer you $12 U.S. for a pair of them! Bill [ 20. July 2003, 09:45 AM: Message edited by: Bill Smith ]
