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Why wasn't the Pacific as "good" as Band of Brothers?

Discussion in 'WWII Films & TV' started by LG'96, Jan 12, 2014.

  1. Owen

    Owen O

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    Finished it yesterday.
    Okinawa was just grim.
    I didnt cry on the last episode, my bottom lip just got twitchy.
    The bit with Sledge & his Dad out hunting was a tad emotional.
    Maybe it's cos I have 2 sons of my own.
    Thanks chaps for making me get around to watching it properly.
    Given it back to my mate now .
    I have ordered a secondhand copy of the book that goes with the serries, see what it's like.
    I must read Sledge's book , another mate offered to lend it to me later this month.
     
  2. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    Glad you enjoyed it Owen. Okinawa was grim. I found it kind of emotionally exhausting. Do read Sledge's book, it is one of the better books you will ever read. I have "The Pacific" book also, it's OK, but not on the level of "With the Old Breed". Few books are.
     
  3. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    Glad you're enjoying it too, KJ Jr. I have both series and think both are excellent. "The Pacific" wasn't the PTO version of "Band of Brothers", it was something different altogether and when people view it as such they can fully appreciate it for what it was.
     
  4. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    Completely agree
     
  5. LG'96

    LG'96 New Member

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    That's a big change of heart. How so?
     
  6. LG'96

    LG'96 New Member

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    I do actually like Band Of Brothers in a much more different way. it was a heroic tale, very much a hero's journey. When you see the opening, they suffer the same fate but they look like a band of brothers.
     
  7. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    LG'96,

    Everyone has different tastes, art, music, movies, it's personal preference. The same applies here. I don't think Band of Brothers is more "heroic", you don't get more heroic than John Basilone. As for being a "Band of Brothers", I do not think they are any more "brothers" than the Marines of the Pacific. I don't think you will find two people that cared more for one another, in a soldierly way, than Sledge or Snafu. Same, same for Leckie, Runner, Chuckler and Hoosier. An example would be the Peleliu airfield assault by 1st and 5th Marines. Leckie got across to the other side, but Runner was hit. He went back across that killing ground to get a Corpsman and a radio to save his friend. How much more of a brother can you be than to risk you life to save your friend? They all suffered the same hardships as the Marine beside them. Their fates were tied to one another. As for a "heroic tale" and "heroes journey", I don't think there is anything more heroic than a man doing his duty for his friends and his beliefs, despite the savagery, brutality, slaughter, horrid conditions, and suffering they were asked to endure.
     
  8. formerjughead

    formerjughead The Cooler King

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    I think it had a lot to do with the format I watched it in; instead of spreading the 10 hour course of the series over 10 weeks, as it was originally presented, I watched the series in a matter of 3 days. This time it was easier to follow and stay with. I think the show easily could have been done, and been better pervcieved, had it been presented in larger chunks over a shorter period.
    It also may have helped that it's been several years since Band of Brothers.
     
  9. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    and

    I believe it is mostly on the "source" material - Ambrose's "Band of Brothers" and Sledge's "With the Old Breed" are two entirely different "war" books. I have not had the privilege of reading Leckie's book, so I cannot comment on that one.

    Stephen Ambrose writes "heroic tales" with lots of, shall we say, flag waving and Americana. While Sledgehammer gave you the unvarnished side of war that you would never ever find in an Ambrose book - and the differences of the two books are clearly visible in the two series.

    That being said, I wonder how the "Band of Brothers" series would have turned out had Ambrose been much less involved and David Kenyon Webster's "Parachute Infantry: An American Paratrooper's Memoir of D-Day and the Fall of the Third Reich" was used as the main "source". Although, without Ambrose "championing" the project, I doubt that it would even have been made into a series.
     
  10. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps this conversation will add the Mighty Eighth soon.
     
  11. LG'96

    LG'96 New Member

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    Mr.Price, i mean to say cosmetically in the opening. I'm sorry if i shat on your marine culture, which i did not mean to do. I repect the USMC a lot, and i have read Leckie's memoir. My only regret is that Richard Greer did not write memoir. My point was about the opening, the brotherlyness is great in all soldiers. From the Winter war to leyte.
     
  12. LG'96

    LG'96 New Member

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    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsdHfzfMtv0


    you can't get better than this
     
  13. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    LG'96 wrote:


    I didn't think you did "shat on" my Marine culture. Then again, I wasn't arguing my point from the perspective of the "Marine Culture", you can take the earlier episodes on Guadalcanal or New Britain, plop a US Army or Australian soldier in the Marines place and they had a similar experience. New Guinea, Bougainville, etc. were a similar experience. I don't think a soldiers experience on Okinawa differed much, if any, from that of the Marines that fought there.
    "Band of Brothers" is more in line with what most people expect from a "War" film and they are more comfortable with that depiction. "The Pacific" is different, it is not what people expect from a "War" film, it is more about what the individual service members experienced, and in this case it wasn't cleaned up a lot to make it easier for the civilian population's consumption. Certain parts are uncomfortable. The real Pacific was more brutal than the European theater. Most viewers and members of this board are of European derivation, we share much culturally with the Germans and Italians. The Japanese were a totally foreign culture, their views and actions were often as totally alien to the western troops that faced them as they would have been had they been from another planet.
    Some casualty figures to illustrate my point: The percentage of ground combat forces killed in action Pacific vs European 1.78 to .36--percentage of ground combat forces wounded in action Pacific vs European 5.50-1.74--percentage of ground forces MIA Pacific vs Europe .17 vs .06--Total 7.45-2.16
    The Eastern Front? Now that's another story.

    The intro to "The Pacific" is different, and it does focus on the three primary characters than the group as a whole. This is line with the perspective being shown, "The Pacific" focusing more on the individual experiences of the individual men. I can't take credit for this, another member posted this and I thought it very perceptive. The charcoal in the intro, being used to draw the pictures keeps fracturing and breaking under pressure. Deeper meaning?
     
  14. Clementine

    Clementine Member

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    As I know I posted elsewhere, I found The Pacific to be just as compelling as Band of Brothers, and that's saying a great deal because I loved Band of Brothers

    I had a couple of people tell me they couldn't keep with the story line, which I found really odd. But I did have an advantage, if you will, when I watched. As soon as I heard they were making the series, I read Leckie's and Sledge's book. Maybe that's why I didn't have trouble distinguishing.

    As others have touched on, and I think I said in my post about this in a different thread, I do think Band of Brothers may has set the bar so high - it elicited such an emotional response, it created a such a sense of affection and loyalty for the men of Easy Company, and Richard Winters was the ultimate hero, there were no ambiguities, he was intelligent, he had strong morals and he was brave - it was almost inevitable, I suppose, that everything else would pale in comparison.

    Maybe it is because I read those two books first, and I developed a particular soft spot for Sledge, the same affection I feel for the men of Easy Company, that I like The Pacific so much.

    Belasar, I disagree that the way they handled the end of Okinawa and the announcement of the atomic bomb almost like a deus ex machine. I felt it was the perfect touch. I recall the first time I watched it, I've watched it several times, being stunned by that, it immediately caught my attention. It spoke volumes to me about how traumatized these men were that it meant nothing to them in that moment. It is shocking to us, but after what those men had gone through they just didn't care, and I don't know that they even really had an inkling of how big it was, they had been focused so long on just living minute to minute. It was so subtle and so real.

    It will be interesting to see what Spielberg and Hanks do with Miller's book, Masters of the Air. There wasn't a single story line, it was a multitude of stories. But it was an excellent book....And I am waiting for the series.
     
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  15. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    Current rumors are that the projected series will revolve around the 100th Bomb Group aka "the Bloody 100th".

    This article seems to support those rumors: http://savannahnow.com/news/2013-10-18/world-war-ii-vets-share-b-17-memories-savannah#.Uv6qd4WLdOw

    Although there were not in action "from the opening bell", they did have a long and colorful history.
    http://www.100thbg.com/index.htm

    So, it is quite possible that there will be one overall story arc.
     
  16. LG'96

    LG'96 New Member

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    Well, It would be nice to have a miniseries on thew Australian Army in ww2. Marines and Pacific Theater are very ubiquitous. I think the charcoal is a symbol. of the black sands, souls and minds or all the soldiers that fought.
     
  17. Owen

    Owen O

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    Does anyone know anymore about Sledge's brother's service ?
    I'm sure he must have seen some grimness too though in the series the Sledge character looks at him with some distain .

    As that taxi driver who dropped Leckie off said ''I may have jumped into Normandy but at least I got to Paris & London, all you Gyrines got was the jungle & malaria'' or words to that effect.
     
  18. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    Good question Owen, I'd be interested in Sledge's brothers service also.
     
  19. Takao

    Takao Ace

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  20. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    Man Takao, you are an expert at finding information. You never cease to impress me!
     

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