Discussion in 'Free Fire Zone' started by C.Evans, Jun 26, 2008.
I'm at a loss for words...
Again well said, Ike< JC, Skunk.W, Wil, Jeff, Tik, Pete, et el. The above photo of a six-gun is the newer version of what I was issued to carry when I worked as a Correctional Officer for the State of Texas.
Did I ever have to pull it from it's holster? the answer is-No-I never had to unholster my firearm. Had someone tried to escape-I would have shot him with the AR-15 that I was issued to also carry when performing my duties as Perimeter Guard. Im OK at hitting what I need to hit with a pistol but, im much much more proficient with a rifle :-D
At times, I was also issued with a 30-40 Winchester model 1894 Repeating lever-action Rifle, as well as a crappy Shotgun. Heres one for you Miguel.B, I don't care for shotguns never having bought one but, I have no personal usage for shotguns. Rifles and pistols are my preferred weapons of choice.
Among my duties as Perimeter Guard, anytime an inmate stepped outside the three fences, I had my rifle in hand and resting on a metal rail at an upward angle-but in the direction that the inmate(s) were at--just in case. From that distance-I would not have missed-had I had to keep the inmate from escaping.
And regarding that article of where that man protected his family. I would have done the same thing if possible? The USA is no longer the Wild West-wild and unruly. This Country is a civilized one but, if killing an intruder means protecting my family-your damn right that im going to shoot to kill him-if possible?
Locally, we just had two incidents this week where an intruder was shot while breaking into someones home. The first one happened I think on Monday-where this business owner confronted two thieves who were trying to steal his industrial Airconditioners as well as anything Copper, that they could get their thieving filthy hands on. Said business owner was working late and in his office-unbeknownst to those two thieves, and the power wet out-so he took a flashlight and had his pistol w/ him and went to go chect the Circuitbreaker. Well, he was about to round the back corner of his building when he heard talking. He pulled out his pistol and then peeked around the corner of the building and seeing two men who I think are in their 40's, trying to steal what they could.
The business owner surprised them and had his pistol ready-and tolld them to Halt! and lay down on the ground. One of the thieves threw a rather large Wrench at the guy-missing him, and the other pulled out a butcher blade and started to advance on the guy. When the buisness owner saw the huge blade-he gave that crook three verbal warnings to throw down that blade-which went ignored while he still advanced towars the buisness owner. Im not sure how many feet seperated the three but, the business owner stepped back, gave his last verbal warning for them to stay put, and then fired several rounds killing the jerk with the butcher knife, and severely wounding the other crook.
End reseult-Crook Nr.1 would still be among the living had he decided not to try to steal someone elses property. Crook Nr.2 is still in intensive care at Spohn Memorial Hospital. Crook Nr.2 would not be there had he too decided not to steal someone elses property. Said Business owner, is now a Hero-and the District Attorney-Carlos Valdez, is not going to prosecute this guy having publicly said so.
Case Nr.2 trhat happened this week-was a Home Invasion. Some gutless bastard decided that he could kick in the front door to some guys house and go pinch whatever he wanted. Well, the homeowners were home, the guy had a loaded shotgun next to where he was sitting, and said all he remembered happening is that the crook kicked in his door, came into his home andtried to ruch to where the guy and his wife and children were at watching TV, and he picked up the shotgun-having no time to warn the crook, and shot and killed him. This man saved his family by killing this creep.
When the Police arrived, they found in the creeps hand, a Baretta 9 MM handgun-safety was off. This creep had the intentions of harming this mans family. Again, if I had been in his place, I too would have shot that jerk. Again, the Distric Atty is not going to prosecute this man, for protecting his family.
Again I reiterate I'm not against gun ownership and JC, I said in the situation you presented, I'd probably have reacted the same way the other guy did. As for meddling, I'm giving my opinion and debating it. I'm not imposing it. Anyway, it's getting tiring as I said.
Opinion noted. Counter-Opinion, also noted.
Choice prevents the "Blame Game".
"You forced me to do this."
You prevented me from doing that."
Taking things away does not prevent anything. If anything it promotes desire for the "forbidden".
How far did your mugger(s) have to go to get their gun(s) ? The beach ? GC works...eh ?
The first fishing boat that was in African waters ?
What you suggest only prevents legal/trained/registered owners from weapon ownership, and it also prevents jobs increases incentive for "criminals" to perpetrate their trade against the unarmed.
As well it is miss-conceived as a "Magic-Pill" to end (ha ha), or reduce crime. Thereby lulling the delusional into decreasing Police sizes.
What they believe is a two-fer for the good, is a two-fer for the worse !
Crime is a business like any other, and the professionals take careful "note" of opportunities (and probably "LOBBY" for what you (think you want) as well).
Leave it to choice.
Everything is a "Double Edged Sword"
Every action has an equal & opposite re-action. Sir Issac Newton
Nature "hates" a void !
Can I get an Amen.
I have watched this thread with great interest.
However, you are only discussing situations within your own countries.
Personally I have never been threatened in my own country (and there are reasons for that..), but it has happened twice while I was visiting foreign countries.
By brute force and fast reaction, I/we got out of the situations before they turned into something worse.
If you have to travel by plane, it's impossible to bring with you a gun.
It's also virtually impossible to get a license to carry a gun in a foreign country if you are a tourist or a business traveller.
This make you an easy prey if someone wants to assault you.
Like JCF, I became familiar with guns when I was a boy.
My father was a naval officer and we had several guns at home.
Around 1970-72, shortly after the invasion of Czechoslovakia, the situation was very tense.
In our house we had:
one Lee Enfield .303, one Mauser K98 modified to 7,62 mm,
one Krag-Jörgensen 6,5 mm, one AG-3 7,62 mm assault gun, one MG-34, one Walther P-38 and two 12 gauge shotguns and many hundred rounds of ammo.
Quite an arsenal, by present day measure.
When the war ended in 1945 Norway bristled with guns, from small arms to 40,6 cm guns in coastal fortifications.
In addition to what the 355 000 german troops had, the norwegian resistance groups had been supplied with guns by air drops.
There were literally raining guns from above.
Less than 10 000 men in the resistance received:
24 000 Lee Enfield .303 rifles (I own one of these today.)
7 000 Stenguns
3 000 Brenguns
7 000 M1 Cal .30 Carbines
7 000 000 rounds of ammunition
40 tons of explosives
After the war there was little or no control with these guns. When the germans capitulated, there was no armed forces around to replace them.
When the allies finally showed up, many civilians had already taken what they needed, from handguns to rifles, submachine guns (especially the MP-40), machineguns and even light anti-tank guns.
This just in case the russians were coming to replace the germans..
For many years, gun control was virtually non-existent.
It was OK that former resistance fighters kept their Stenguns or Lee Enfields as souvenirs.
Since then things have grown increasingly worse for us gun owners.
What I have left today is the Krag-Jörgensen, the Lee Enfield, the K98 and two shotguns.
I have to keep these guns in a steel locker. 24 hrs/7 days a week, the police can knock on my door and check if I have the guns properly locked up.
This means that you are almost defenseless!
Unless you are warned before the criminals break into your home, and you rarely are, they find you unarmed.
There are very few shooting incidents were people are killed by legal guns, but of course it happens.
Then all these Michael Moore wannabes show up on TV crying and whining for more gun control.
And who are going to pay for that?
Right; the owners that have legally acquired their guns.....
First you get scrutinized before you get permission to buy and own a gun.
Then the police can show up at your door at any time to check if you keep your guns locked up in a proper way.
Since the fall of the Soviet Union, we have been blessed with so called "tourists" from the east.
Norway has a one hundred kilometers border to Russia, so access is easy.
They arrive on a 3 months tourist visa, and while they are here they steal whatever they get their hands on.
These guys (the girls are usually prostitutes) are hard core criminals, some with background from the Soviet forces. They usually carry illegal weapons, and they will knock you down, break your fingers and arms or even shoot you without a blink of an eye.
If they are arrested they spend a few months in jail, then they are sent back to their country.
After a short while they come back, with a new passport, a new name and a new visa...
Michael Moore is right about one thing: there are too much money in this country.
He was going to make a movie about the welfare system in Norway, but he gave it up. People in the US will not believe this, he said. They would think he was making things up.
This attracts criminals like a piece of shit attracts flies.
We have a left wing government right now, but by next year this will end.
Then all these parasites will be sent back home were they belong.
BRAVISIMO RAM--very well-said.
Also, the thing about keeping guns locked in cabinets here-was already tried in Texas-but was quickly shot down (pardon the pun) ;-D I don't know how it is in other state here but-at least in Texas-one does not have to have their guns locked up-which like you say-would give the criminals more time to harm you and you would not have a chance to protect your family-or your property.
Thank goodness that common-sense will soon again rain-on Norway and Norwegians-by kicking the morons out of office.
Im impressed-your family had an MG-34!--nice-v~e~r~y nice ;-)) I wish you still had it.
Thanks for your appreciation, Carl!
The Lee Enfield, the MG 34 and the P38 were guns my father got during and at the end of the war.
The MG 34 he turned over to the authorities when he didn't get a lisence because it was an MG!
By the mid 1970s, the happy days of owning WWII guns were over.
We only have memories left of days gone by like this:
YouTube - Arizona MG shooters (Machine gun event)
The Walther P38 had a special history. It was the sidearm of the
SS-Obersturmbannführer Gerhard Flesch, the head of the Gestapo in Trondheim.
Gerhard Flesch - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
My father was born and raised in Trondheim, a city located in the middle of Norway.
During the war he became involved in a resistance group.
During the RAF raid on the "Tirpitz" in the Trondheim fjord, they got orders from London to help surviving bomber aircrew from being captured by the germans in case they were shot down.
A few planes were shot down, but they went down in the north-east perimeter and my father was positioned in the southern perimeter.
On their way back home they were stopped and warned that the Gestapo was waiting for them in Trondheim.
In fact, a Gestapo officer and a norwegian collaborator sat in my grandmother's kitchen questioning her.
My father and my grandfather headed for the mountains were they stayed for the rest of the war.
However, the Gestapo had discovered the resistance network and many of my father's friends were arrested, tortured and died later on in KZ-camps.
In May 1945 it was payback time!
My father was in the group that caught this guy Gerhard Flesch when he tried to escape.
He was later sentenced to death: Trial of Gerhard Friedrich Enrst Flesch, SS OBE Sturmbannführer, Oberregierungsrat. United Nations War Crimes Commission.
My father secured his sidearm and kept it as a souvenir.
In the late 1970s he gave it to a war museum together with some Gestapo documents he had, and which he later came to regret.
When he visited the museum a few years later they told him that the gun was missing.
They had the Gestapo documents but the pistol was lost.
This bothered him for the rest of his life. He died last winter, 84 years old.
Interesting, good points except Michael Moron isn't right about anything Thanks for the Historical stuff, I used to chat with a guy by the call sign of BergFlak from Norway, a nice fellow with lots of Mauser parts.
Yes and we'll add to firearms list: cars, kitchen knives and deep water.
Not from where I'm typing.....
True, but I wouldn't waste a perfectly good cup of tea or a condo on either of them .......besides the condo would probably conflict with their religious cult beliefs in Global Boring(warming, for those in Rio Linda).
Shoot, a feller could have a pretty good weekend in Vegas with all that stuff.
..........Nice Avatar SW
Or How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love Firearms.
Hi RAM, quite welcome ;-))
My Grandfather Ottar, was born and raised in or near Oslo-from what I have been told. He came to the USA back before WWI and got his US citizenship because he joined the Army and fought as a Doughboy. Im not sure what he did immediately after WWI but, at some-point, he joined the Merchant Marines and became a ship Captain.
During WWII, he (being a man from an occupied country) and as my Mother told me, could have been shot if ever captured. Well, on November 2nd 1944, his ship the SS Fort Lee, was torpedoed by U 181 under the command of Kapitan zue See Kurt Freiwald. My friend Karl Kaiser, served on U 181 since the Navy took possession of the uboat from the dockyards. His commander at that time, was none other than Wolfgang Luth ;-))
Anyway, I don't yet know much of what happened after the SS Fort Lee was torpedoed as I got a series of stories from my mother, from the Germans, and soon will hopefully be learning more from a very nice Gentleman whom I had a chat with by phone recently. His Daughter was kind enough (after reading about the SS Fort Lee on this site) was kind enough to provide me with an address and phone numbers.
Hopefully with in the next few months, hopefully I can have a copy of the SS Fort Lees log book. This will be some interesting reading-providing I can read my Grandfathers handwriting ;-)) Of course, the entries into that log book, ended on Feb 2nd 1944-somewhere in the Atlantic Ocean. The Gentleman whom I will be in touch with, was made head cook, and cook for my Grandfather.
When the surviving crew were in lifeboats, this man was in the same boat as my grandfather. ;-)) I can hardly wait till I can further talk with this gentlman.
Sorry im off your topic and I did not mean to steal your thread.
Sorry that your Father has passed away. It would have been great to hear his war stories.
About that pistol that is now missing. Yep, its a shame that someone pinched it-the same thing happened on a few significant items at the local Museum I volunteered for.
If I may comeback to this, I'd like to quote something I've read elsewhere. Strangely, I agree...
One of my favorites...
A woman interviewing Marine Corp General Reinwald concerning guns and children on (NPR) National Public Radio, as he's about to sponsor a Boy Scout Troop visiting his military installation.
FEMALE INTERVIEWER: So General, what things are you going to teach these young boys when they visit your Base?
GENERAL REINWALD: We're going to teach then climbing, canoing, archery, and shooting.
F-I: Shooting! That's a bit irresponsible, isn't it?
G-R: I don't see why, they'll be properly supervised on the rifle range.
F-I: Don't you admit that this is a terribly dangerous activity to be teaching children?
G-R: I don't see how. We will be teaching them proper rifle discipline before they even touch a firearm.
F-I: But you're equipping them to be violent killers.
G-R: Well, you're equipped to be a prostitute, but you're not one, are you?
ROTFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GOOD NE!!!
That is why I am armed, Za.
I agree Jeff, no problem.
Ahhh, politics and history as seen by Holywood! The problem was not the humble missionaries trying to protect the rain forest and its innocent inhabitants, problem was the Company of Jesus was getting awfully big for it's boots and growing from a state within the state to taking over the state entirely. This process was stopped with the eviction of CoJ and at the same time the Supreme Sacred Congregation of the Holy Office, aka the Portuguese Inquisition was emasculated and taken over by the State as a sort of local Gestapo. As a side effect the end the rain forest + innocent inhabitants got screwed, but again that's collateral damage.
Ditto here Miguel. Also, if Heather and I ever get married, she will be a gun-totin female. Back in 1995-she lothed guns-after being kidnapped and raped by a lowest form of scum she had me teach her what I know and now shes a pretty-darned good shot with both 9MM pistol and also with an M-16 Rifle ;-)) Unfortunately that rifle aint mine. At some point, I plan on buying an M-14-and will teach her to use that one as well.
News of the day: over here a couple of scumbags entered a bank branch and held the personnel and public inside hostage at gunpoint. This is completely unheard of in this neck of the woods.
After a few hours of active negotiations, the local police solved the situation by rescuing the hostages. One of the perpetrators managed to evade arrest by being medicated with a number of 9mm pills, the other will hopefully reach court after recovery.
All hostages are in good health, even if a bit hard of hearing for a while as police neglected to supply them with ear protection before the gunnery started, but I don't think they'll sue for negligence.
I dunno, but I think this speedy outcome will make a number of people think twice. Nope, the cops here have no sense of humour at all
As well these "Creeps" have to think twice about the rest of us, and not just Banks.
An "effective" negotiator/counselor/therapist/adviser
Miguel, I think I heard part of that story? and glad it ended in the best way-with no hostigas being killed.
Skunk.W/ great shot of Charles Buchinski (aka) Charles Bronson) as Paul Kersey ;-)) I am a big fan of his Death Wish movies (among others. ;-))
i love his Line.... "DO YOU BELIVE IN GOD?? GOOD BECAUSE YOUR GONNA MEET HIM" lol as he blows the crooks brains out