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Luftwaffe Raido Beacons

Discussion in 'Air War in Western Europe 1939 - 1945' started by Sbiper, Oct 29, 2007.

  1. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    All,

    1st post at this forum so please be nice! I was wondering if anybody know of a websitre where there is a list/map of Luftwaffe radio beacons; specifically those used by the Nachtjagdwaffe in conjunction with the Zame Sau tactics.

    If there is no online source for this, would anybody have this info offline in a book or such? At a minimun i just need the names of two or three beacons in the Berlin area.

    Rgrds,

    Sbiper.
     
  2. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    well newcomer you need to start looking at some of the threads today covering lancaster shoot downs.

    here you are anyway.

    GYGES Publishing Company

    if I can help further or anyone else for that matter ask away, why are you interested anyway as I have a specific beacon map of the Berlin area for my future work in progress

    Erich
     
  3. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Thanks for the quick reply, i've allready checked the Gykes website, does not seem to have EXACTLY what i'm looking for.

    As for why exactly i want this info, its to round out my collection on Bomber Command. I have the following Books/Official publications etc. on Bomber Command:

    Non Fiction:

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    The Bomber Command War Diaries. An operational reference book 1939-1945. Martin Middlebrook and Chris Everitt. vv

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    The Berlin Raids. RAF Bomber Command Winter 1943-44. Martin Middlebrook.

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    The Nuremburg Raid 30-31 March 1944. Martin Middlebrook.

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    Bombs Gone. The development and use of British air-dropped weapons from 1912 to the present day. John A.Mac Bean and Arthur S. Hogben.

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    Britain’s Military Airfields 1939-45. David J. Smith.

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    Bomber Command 1939-45 Reaping The Whirlwind. Richard Overey.

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    Action Stations 2 Military airfields of Lincolnshire and the East Midlands. Bruce Barrymore Halpenny.

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    Pursuit Through Darkened Skies. An Ace night-fighter crew in World War II. Michael Allen DFC**.

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    German Secret Weapons of the Second World War. Ian V. Hogg.

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    Last Talons of the Eagle. Secret Nazi technology which could have changed the course of World War II. Gary Hyland and Anton Gill.

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    Wings of the Luftwaffe. Captain Eric Brown CBE, DSC, AFC, RN.
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    The Prize. The epic quest for oil, money and power. Daniel Yergin.

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    The Third Reich 3rdEdition. D.G. Williamson.

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    Confound and Destroy. 100 Group and the bomber support campaign. Martin Streetly.

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    Most Secret War. R.V. Jones.

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    The Other Battle. Luftwaffe night aces versus bomber command. Peter Hinchliffe.

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    Germany’s Guns 1939-45. Terry Gander.

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    Technical and Military Imperatives. A radar history of World War II. Louis Brown.

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    GEMA: The birthplace of German radar and sonar. Harry von Kroge.

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    Ground Radar Systems of the Luftwaffe 1939-1945. Werner Muller.

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    Strategy for Defeat. The Luftwaffe 1933 – 1945. Williamson Murray.

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    Radar Development to 1945 IEE Radar, Sonar, Navigation and Avionics Series 2. Edited by Russell Burns.

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    Luftwaffe Secret Projects Fighters 1939-1945. Walter Schick and Ingolf Meyer.

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    Luftwaffe Secret Projects Strategic Bombers 1935-1945. Dieter Herwig and Heinz Rode.

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    Luftwaffe Secret Projects Ground Attack & Special Purpose aircraft. Dieter Herwig and Heinz Rode.

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    Pathfinders at War. Chaz Bowyer.

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    Avro Lancaster. The Definitive Record 2nd Edition. Harry Holmes.

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    Echoes of War. The Story of H2S. Sir Bernard Lovell.

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    British Secret Projects Fighters & Bombers 1935-1950. Tony Buttler.

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    The Wages of Destruction. The making & breaking of the Nazi economy. Adam Tooze.

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    Bases of Bomber Command Then and Now. Roger A. Freeman.

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    De Havilland Mosquito. Martin W. Bowman.

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    The Secret War. Brian Johnson.

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    Bomber Crew. Survivors of bomber command tell their own story. James Taylor & Martin Davidson.

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    Flak. German Anti-Aircraft defences, 1914-1945. Edward B. Westermann.

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    Bomber Command. Max Hastings.

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    Confounding the Reich. The Operational history of 100 Group (Bomber Support) RAF. Martin W. Bowman and Tom Cushing.

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    Bennett and the Pathfinders. John Maynard.

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    Tail-End Charlies. The last battles of the bomber war 1944-45. John Nichol & Tony Rennell.

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    Bombers. The weapon of total war. Brian Johnson & H.I. Cozens.

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    Instruments of Darkness. The History of Electronic Warfare 1930-1945. Alfred Price.

    ·
    Pathfinder Force. A history of 8 Group. Gordon Musgrove.

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    Reaching for the stars. A new history of bomber command in world war II. Mark Connelly.

    ·
    German Jet Engine and Gas Turbine Development 1930-1945. Antony L. Kay.

    ·
    Lancaster at War 2. Mike Garbett and Brian Goulding.

    ·
    Lancaster at War 4: Pathfinder Squadron. Alex Thorne.

    ·
    The Handley Page Halifax. K.A. Merrick.

    ·
    A World at Arms. A global history of World War II. Gerhard L. Weinberg.

    ·
    Auschwitz and Anglo-American Air Power: Historical Debates and Military Capabilities. Rondall Ravon Rice (Thesis)

    ·
    The Avro Lancaster. A Comprehensive Guide. Richard A. Franks.

    ·
    JG 301 Wilde Sau. Marek j. Murawski and Peter Neurwerth.

    ·
    Luftwaffe Squadrons 1939-45. Chris Bishop.

    ·
    Short Stirling in action. Ron Mackay.

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    Wellington in action. Ron Mackay.

    ·
    Aircrew. The Story of the men who flew the bombers. Bruce Lewis.

    ·
    The Hardest Victory. RAF bomber command in the Second World War. Denis Richards.

    ·
    The Eighth Passenger. Miles Tripp.

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    Looking into hell. Experiences of the bomber command war. Mel Rolfe.

    ·
    Night fighter. The battle for the night skies. Ken Delve.

    ·
    The Destruction of Dresden. David Irving.

    ·
    Why the Allies won. Richard Overy.
    World War II Intelligence Documents and related official Publications:

    ·
    Petroleum facilities of Germany. Enemy Oil Committee 1945.

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    Petroleum facilities of Europe (Austria, Belgium and Luxembourg, Hungary, the Netherlands and Yugoslavia). Enemy Oil Committee 1945.

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    Present Position of Refining Industry in German held Europe November 1943. Enemy Oil Committee.

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    Geographic Handbook Series. Germany Volumes III and IV. Naval Intelligence Division HMSO.

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    The United States Strategic Bombing Survey summary report.

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    The Strategic Air Offensive against Germany 1939-1945 Volume II: Endeavour and Volume III: Victory. Sir Charles Webster and Noble Frankland.

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    Report on the Petroleum and Synthetic Oil Industry of Germany. Ministry of Fuel and Power 1947.

    ·
    Axis Oil Position (November 1943 to June 1944). Joint Intelligence Sub-Committee. War Cabinet and Chiefs of Staff briefing papers.

    ·
    Methods of estimating military consumption of petroleum in axis Europe in 1943. Enemy Oil Committee October 1943.

    ·
    Axis European armed forces – consumption of liquid fuels and lubricants, 1943. Enemy Oil Committee.

    ·
    Axis air force requirements of petroleum, 1942. Enemy Oil Committee.

    Fiction:

    ·
    The Foresight War. Anthony G. Williams.


    ·
    Johnny Kinsman. The classic novel of the British bomber crews of World War II. John Watson.


    ·
    Bomber. Len Deighton.


    I've been looking for information regarding the location of the Luftwaffe Radio/visual beacon network and my sources are poor reagrding this one topic.

    Rgrds,

    Sbiper

    P.S. as my collection is quite extensive, i'd of course be willing to share any information anybody wants.
     
  4. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    well lets see if I can get my GErman map in colour to download soon, it will show what you need from the original German. Fully there really is nothing besides Michaels excellent resource and possibly the 1-2 books covering the bombing of Berlin and it's environs written in German. I'll have to look through my Berlin bombing book by RAF mossies......... a very interesting and a bit strange written in Deutsch.

    Dr. Boitens massive work due out next spring will also as I am almost positive have a disposition map(s) of the Beacons as they were centers of LW activity.

    let me see what I can find
     
  5. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Welcome SB, good you are here with another varied interest.

    Pay no attention to the Reds wafting about, they are all bark and no bite.
     
  6. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Thanks for this, could you explain 1: Michaels excellent resource? and 2: Dr Boitens massive work?

    Any and all info you can get mw will be most welcome.

    Sbiper.
     
  7. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    I thought you said you had visited his site and he goes by SES as his alias on forums. it is the web-site I posted and yes he covers at length beacons their functions and placements.
    Dr. Boitens work is the Nachtjagd War diaries volume 1 covering the Luftwaffe vs the RAF

    hope this works, Berlin and west and hope this is useable ?
     

    Attached Files:

  8. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Ah right the GYGES Publishing Company website. Yes he has loads of information, but i can't seem to find details on the entire radio beacon network, there only seems to be a map of the area around Dortmund (i think) on the Wilde Sau page.

    Thanks for the map you posted, its a little confusing at 1st but i think i understand the symbols used now...:D.

    Sbiper
     
  9. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    just go through all the links to get familiarized with it and check all his updates for the years as there is hidden information within

    alright the eastern side of Berlin
     

    Attached Files:

  10. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Erich,

    If i could not trouble you for one more thing? Which of Dr. Theo Boitens book(s) would you recomend for good Nachtjagdwaffe information?

    Sbiper.
     
  11. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    the first one for the moment "Nachtjagd" I was not too impressed with his second one, and yes wait for the biggie next year over several thousand pilots covered, some with incredible details on operations
     
  12. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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  13. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    yes that is it, but shop around that is too much money even if it is OOP. Excellent title and if you view one page you will see a photo of my cousin and his crew on page : 153 ~ Hptm. Hans Baer second from the left with 12 kills, flying a Do 217N in 4./NJG 3 and later a Bf 110G-4; transferred in as Gruppenkommandeur of II./NJG 5. Killed in a stupid accident in December of 1943
     
  14. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Yes the book is very pricey, might give it a pass....and i have found a list on the gyges site that shows a map of the Schweres Funk Feuer, my German is a little rusty and i did not immediately notice this...:rolleyes:. But those maps also list the visual beacons so thats great aswell, thanks again.

    Sbiper.
     
  15. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Erich,

    Sorry to bother you, but a quick question regarding the maps you posted? The yellow and grey blobs i assume are searchlight and flak defended areas right? If so which color represents searchlights and which represents flak?

    Sbiper.
     
  16. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Oh and if you have any more maps of the rest of Eurpoe they would be appreciated!!!!!
     
  17. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    there are light as well as sound beacons posted, some are the same as they sat right next to each other. around the cities looks like a red ? possibly black zig-zagged grid which indicates usually Flak defenses and even a corridor of sorts. the Searchlights are not shown due to the mobile nature of the units even in and outside of cities such as Berlin, Leipzig and Chemnitz. Besides stationary flak you also have the heavies like single 128mm's fitted on flat rail cars that were moved constantly to through off the Allied surveillance craft

    I do have the symbols marked somewhere as well as a very extensive listing in German of the associated beacons and get together areas for LW craft mobilization but this is will be included in my book so will not share at this moment.
    As to other maps I have plenty but again for personal reason and other book commitments will not be shared sorry. On the net somewehre and Michael may even have searchlight patterns on the early radar Himmelbett system before Normandie invasion posted. I know he has a ton buried, reason I said to go through his brilliant sight very very slowly
     
  18. Erich

    Erich Alte Hase

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    let me just briefly add that while looking through a German book on the bombing of Berlin sitting in my lap I note some 35 Flakstellungen by name. Each flak stellung comprised between 16 and 24 flak pieces usually 88's but also 105's in the mix plus the heavy tall concrete bunkers housing twin 128mm's in the center of Berlin ~ Flakbunker Humboldthain, Flakbunker Zoo and Flakbunker Friedrichshain. The defense of the city went as far as Werneuchen home of the radar and weapons testing unit for night fighters NJGr 10 which also helped in countering the RAF 4 engines and Mosquitos
     
  19. Skipper

    Skipper Kommodore

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    Wow, I missed all the nice talk while I was on my trip to Normandy, I see Erich said it all though, the colour map is a beauty, I only have a black in white copy. I have testimonies of people who mention portable searchlight patterns on horse driven karts, same for light flak, so it's quite hard to get all the positions. I don't know if you are interested behind the Kambhuber line only, or if you want anyhting on the West front. If this is the case I can help you with western and central France.
     
  20. Sbiper

    Sbiper Member

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    Sure i'd love any amy and all info you have on the defences in Holland and France.

    Sbiper.
     

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