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Why do the jews stand out?

Discussion in 'Concentration, Death Camps and Crimes Against Huma' started by ZeJanIt, Aug 12, 2016.

  1. ZeJanIt

    ZeJanIt Member

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    I study WW2 and all American war history. I've always wondered why the Jewish people REFUSED to not standout. with their hair, sideburns, prayers..etc


    After the Night of Broken Glass I would have started walking!! I get it was a secret, just a "relocation" for work after they took all your businesses and jobs from you, but STILL. Maybe since we know of the possibility of these Nazi dogs and crimes of this magnitude we are smarter? we watch for it... maybe?

    but you must agree there were some smart Jewish people who did blend in. why didn't they all, are your Jewish beliefs worth so much. I would have done it just for my family!
     
  2. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    The Hasidic Jews are, indeed, noticeable in a crowd. But the run of the mill Jew, not so much. Look at pictures of the Warsaw ghetto.
     
  3. ZeJanIt

    ZeJanIt Member

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    sure in the Warsaw ghetto they have lost everything, they are trying to blend in now. but before... they would go to their Jewish synagogues and act like jews. I mean don't take this the wrong way. no human should ever, never, ever be treated in any wrong way. but I'm talking theory...like blending in, running.


    i know no country really would take them, and all us other countries be damned for it. but still!!!
     
  4. wm.

    wm. Well-Known Member

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    In Germany Jews were registered with various state agencies, including the police. The sideburns didn't matter. A Jew couldn't do anything without his papers, and in the papers his Jewishness was recorded.

    In Poland there were no papers but the Jews were registered with Kehillas.
    It was their own electable local self-governments - with their own laws, taxes, ordinances. Every city or town where there lived had one.
     
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  5. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    You mean they were trying to blend in, in the ghetto? Really?
     
  6. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member Patron  

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    The Jews acted like Jews because that's who they were. Why should they have acted differently? They were simply following the tenets of their faith. It wasn't their fault that the leaders of Germany decided to single them out. It wasn't a matter of "blending in". Their neighbors knew their faith and were encouraged to turn them in.
     
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  7. wm.

    wm. Well-Known Member

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    The Jews were ordered to move into ghettos a few years before the Holocaust, and they did willingly themselves, they neighbors had nothing to do it. Only a tiny minority didn't do it, and stayed outside.

    But after the Holocaust had started, various bounty rewards were offered for Jews living outside the Ghettos, and those "bounty programs" were sometimes quite successful.
     
  8. Biak

    Biak Adjutant Patron  

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    Blend in ? Go along with the 'Party Line" so as not to draw attention to yourself?
    Look how that worked out for the German people. Their Country in ruins at the end of WW2 and to this day a stigma upon their History.
     
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  9. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    This happened on which alternate Earth?
     
  10. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member Patron  

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  11. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    Huh?
     
  12. wm.

    wm. Well-Known Member

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    They say exactly the same:

    During World War II, the Germans concentrated urban and sometimes regional Jewish populations in ghettos. Living conditions were miserable. Ghettos were often enclosed districts that isolated Jews by separating Jewish communities from the non-Jewish population and from other Jewish communities. The Germans established at least 1,000 ghettos in German-occupied and annexed Poland and the Soviet Union alone.

    German occupation authorities established the first ghetto in Poland in Piotrków Trybunalski in October 1939. The largest ghetto in Poland was the Warsaw ghetto. In Warsaw, more than 400,000 Jews were crowded into an area of 1.3 square miles. Other major ghettos were established in the cities of Lodz, Krakow, Bialystok, Lvov, Lublin, Vilna, Kovno, Czestochowa, and Minsk. Tens of thousands of western European Jews were also deported to ghettos in the east.

    Nazi-appointed Jewish councils (Judenraete) administered daily life in the ghettos. A ghetto police force enforced the orders of the German authorities and the ordinances of the Jewish councils. This included facilitating deportations to killing centers. Jewish police officials, like Jewish council members, served at the whim of the German authorities.

    The Germans saw the ghettos as a provisional measure to control and segregate Jews while the Nazi leadership in Berlin deliberated upon options for the removal of the Jewish population.
     
  13. wm.

    wm. Well-Known Member

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  14. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    The point that the Jews "willingly went themselves" is erroneous and causing confusion.

    Did you mean it as it is stated or am I misunderstanding you?
     
  15. wm.

    wm. Well-Known Member

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    "Willingly" in contrast to "rounded up with force". Certainly it doesn't mean the Jews loved to live in ghettos.

    But it means too that the "stand out" didn't matter, at all. The authorities knew who was a Jew and who wasn't. The had collected such information in their "databases" for many years.

    In Warsaw the Jews were given a month, in Łódź three months, to sell their houses and move their property to the designated districts. The non-Jews living there were given the same time to move out.
    After that they were allowed to leave the ghetto at will, it was merely their place of residence.

    But later even this right was denied to them, and their become prisoners in their ghettos. Anybody caught outside was fined 100 zlotys (about $500 today).

    In Warsaw there was a sweep done after the ghetto was finally closed, only about 11,000 Jews were found outside, and they actually had to be moved to the ghetto with force.

    I mention the two ghettos because obviously there were the largest of them all. Over 600,000 Jews lived there.

    The point is the narration "the Nazis and the neighbours" sent the Jews to their deaths in gas chambers is false.
    The Jews lived in walled ghettos. From those isolated from outside ghettos it was easy to transport them in stages to the death camps. Every day over 10,000 was sent, till there were none left, many of them didn't even realise they were going to be killed.
     
  16. Ken The Kanuck

    Ken The Kanuck Member

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    I suspect that by the time the Nazis true intentions dawned upon the Jewish people it was too late they were already Identified.

    Hindsight is always 20-20, but the final solution would of seemed impossible. What normal person could imagine evil such as that, it would of seemed impossible just as it seems impossible for this to happen in our country now.

    KTK
     
  17. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    OK, thanks for the clarification. I was a bit concerned about your stance.
     
  18. Terry D

    Terry D Well-Known Member

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    The phrase "The Jews" needs to be carefully qualified. The original poster here seems to be taking only one segment of the European Jewish community (the stricter Orthodox and Hasidim) as representative of the whole. Even in Poland the Jewish community included many different groups and individuals who differed from one another according to their styles of religious practice and belief, degree of adjustment to the modern world, assimilation to the external (Gentile) community, language, etc. Especially in western countries like France, Germany, and Holland, many Jews were secularized and well-assimilated, distinguishable only from their Gentile fellow citizens by their religious beliefs. Many secularized Jews were also non-practicing. It was characteristic of the Nazi viewpoint to lump all Jews together and to identify even the most modern minded and well-assimilated Jews with the exotic, un-assimilated "foreign" Orthodox and Hasidim of Poland and Russia. The stranger someone can be made to appear the more easy it is to imagine them as an enemy.
     
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  19. LRusso216

    LRusso216 Graybeard Staff Member Patron  

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    As always, Terry has defined the situation. Many Jews, especially in Western Europe, were barely distinguishable from the rest of their countrymen. The Nazis used the Orthodox and Hasidic Jews (mostly in Eastern Europe) as the symbol of Jewry. Given the economic conditions of the 30s, it was easier to identify the Jews as emblematic of the economic and social upheavals that were occurring. The Nazi propoganda macine was adept at building on the fear that many had.
     
  20. ZeJanIt

    ZeJanIt Member

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    nope, READ it all. i never mentioned the ghetto in my first post, someone else did, then i replied.. I was speaking of before that ever happened.
     

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