Best modern handgun?

He isn´t. He´s a full blooded Austrian. Do you think he´s just faking that accent ?

 

OK guys, point of order.

Are we talking about the best self defense weapon, or are we talking about pistols? The two are quite different.

There is no better all around weapon for self defense than a pump 12 gauge, short barelled shot gun. Load it with bird shot. With that load, you shred anything you hit within the confines of one's home but the load will rarely goo through a wall and kill a loved one that is asleep in their bed in an adjoining room.

If we are talking pistols the .45 ACP hands down. At 600-800 fps, the 230 grain bullet will expend most, if not all of its energy within the body. You do not need "hollow points" or "silver tips". It has expanded all it needs to when it leaves the barrel.

With the 9mm and .357 you run the risk of total body penetration so that the bullet does not expend its total energy within the target.

The single most important aspect in any self defense weapon is the user. The right person with a single shot .22 caliber rifle can be your worst nightmare.

Know thy self, and know thy weapon.

:smok:

 

Who was the last Austrian to have control of a large but nearly bankrupt economy?

 

Careful now. Just because he's Austrian doesn't mean he's a genocidal megalomaniac.

Greg, I believe this topic is about handguns, not self-defence weapons specifically. As for the short-barreled shot gun, wouldn't it be a bit of a bummer to have only two shots?

 

Did I say that?

 

Ok - Pistols.

Just to answer one question someone put:

No, the shotgun carries 6 rounds in the tube; one in the chamber, and a side mount carrier with six more shots. If you need more than that, you are in deep doo dah!

:smok:

 

Fair enough! I've never seen a real shot gun.

 

Ah, the difference between the sporting models and the very unsporting pump-action...

 

Roel my young scholarly friend, you just have not lived!

Going out and letting loose with a bunch of ammo is great!

Once I bought some of those devices called "hellfire", which is a device placed on the trigger mechanism of a semi-automatic rifle. In the hands of an experienced user one can fire almost like "full auto". You can burn 30 rounds in a few seconds. (They are legal in the USA).

I never liked them that much but my son got a real kick out it. I removed the item and have no idea whatever happened to it.

If you have never seen a real shotgun I am sorry. It's like so many things. One never realizes what one has missed until one has it in their hands (sort of like a beautiful woman)!

:smok:

 

I knew a .45 fan would show up somewhere and that's fine, but a 9mm risking overpenetration? Maybe if you're shooting armor piercing rounds with tungsten tips.......

 

I found some information about .45 ACP one shot stop percentage. It seem to vary a lot depending on used ammunition. 230 grain FMJ has around 63% one shot stop percentage whereas Federal 230 grain Hydra-Shok bullets have 94% one shot stop percentage. I'm not sure how valid this information is, I found it from Chuck Hawks webpage http://www.chuckhawks.com/
Same website says 9mm FMJ has 62% one shot stop percentage.

 

It is nothing special. especially after seeing the effects.

 

I think someone is trying to sell you some ammo!

Also, GP ... 9mm hollow point I agree. 9mm FMJ not so. And on that note, I must say that the 9mm round has killed more men than all other calibres combined. So no doubt, it has something going for it. I was a 9mm fan the 1st half of my life. Now I an a 45 ACP fan.

That's only because they don't make a 46 calibre!

:smok:

 

Son't know what ammo was used, there wasn't much left, only half a head.

 

Sounds more like a shotgun wound at close range.

A 9mm would not do that. We are talking 9mm parabellum are we not and not the 9mm Steyer?

:smok:

 

Well, I'm not a fan of any calibre and actually I dont own a handgun now. Of course you can be fan of anything as long as you remember that no calibre is good for everything.

 

Not during the Gulf of 1990.

 

Police departments in the U.S. switched enmasse to the 9mm during the 80's because of the high capacity (usually 15 or 16 bullets) magazines. After extremely poor results with lack of stopping power (and U.S. police usually use jacketed hollow point ammo), most have since switched to either .40 caliber or .45 caliber. Some tried the 10 mm, but they were somewhat of an semi-automatic version of a .44 magnum, too powerful, and prone to failures.

I'll agree with Chuck Hawk's assessment of Hydra-shoks, but he's dreaming with those 9mm figures.

 

Sgt Bob, Just out of curiosity, what do you carry while on duty, if you don't mind me asking?

Took a quick look at Chuck Hawk's web page but it appears that a lot is by subscription only. The one article I did read made a point I am sure you will agree with: Regardless of load, accuracy is the key in "stopping power" (or shot placement).

From my discussions with many law enforcement officers, they have told me that most people do not realize how difficult it is to fire accurately in a gun fight. The adrennalin (spelling?) rush is so intense, one officer told me that the only way he thought one could simulate the effect is to run about 100 yards full steam then stop, bring your weapon up, and shoot at the target.

I am also told that over 90% of gun fights happen at 10 feet or less. Do you have any recent information on this that you can share?

Since you are in that line of work yourself, I would value your opinion.

Thanks!

:smok:

 

Greg, you can access more and longer articles thorough webarchive. That Chuck Hawks page was formerly totally free.
http://www.archive.org/