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city with most spies?

Discussion in 'Codes, Cyphers & Spies' started by bronk7, Aug 22, 2015.

  1. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    what city do you think had the most spy action or spies?? did it change with the strategic balance of the war?? was it Bern? thanks all replies
     
  2. Dave55

    Dave55 Member

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    Lisbon had a lot.
     
  3. Fred Wilson

    Fred Wilson "The" Rogue of Rogues

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    Edit this to turn it into a poll. K? This could be fun...

    My best guess bet would be Toronto, thanks to Intrepid...

    Will ask next week, Dr. Jeff Noakes and / or Peter Macleod 659 at Canada's National WW2 War Museum: http://www.nationalww2museum.org/
    1 Vimy Place Ottawa, Ontario Canada K1A 0M8 1-800-555-5621 the hit 2 2 5
     
  4. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    Toronto? wow...very interesting..I've become more interested in the spy aspect of the war, more so than general battles, so I'm not as educated in the area..haven't read as much on it as other areas.....yes, Libson I have read about [ not much ]....I was there for a port call in 87', but didn't go off ship...
     
  5. TiredOldSoldier

    TiredOldSoldier Ace

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    I would be in doubt between Lisbon and Bern, looking at the Nazi "escapees" in 1945, Axis ties to some South American capitols may also have been extensive.

    But if we go for "spies and saboteurs to population" ratio I believe Algeciras gets the prize.
     
  6. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    much thanks....I just searched that.......how very 'exciting' and interesting to think all around that area was a hot war.....while the spies were 'safe' in the neutral country....if I ever could travel, that would have to be one of my destinations
     
  7. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    Probably depends on how you count spies. If you include agents for the various factions within some countries as well as foreign agents then I suspect it's one of the cities in China.
     
  8. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    sounds logical.....did the Axis and Allies have more in China than any other country??
     
  9. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    I suspect a lot depends on what you consider a spy and whether or not they count as alligned with the axis or allies if they don't know who they were spying for. The Japanese for instance I suspect had quite a few Chinese that they regularly got information from. Some of these were likely working for one faction of the nationalis or another and/or the reds. The Soviets were probably in the same boat. Pre war the British, US, and French would all have had some agents there as well as local sources. Then of course the various factions are spying on each other, do those all count as "allied spies"?
     
  10. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    I would think some doubled as spying on intra-factions and foreign countries....yes, I never thought of the Russians in China....never was on my reeading lists......much thanks, as it wets my appetite and gives me many ideas for research...but what city?? Peking, Shanghai ? wouldn't the spies be safer and have more in neutral countries??
     
  11. lwd

    lwd Ace

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    Well technically China was neutral until Dec of 41. Neither Japan nor China declared war up to that point for various reasons (we could still send weapons to China for instance if they weren't "at war"). The capital would be the likely place for the most spies in China especially with the various Chinese factions trying to gain intel on each other. The Japanese would also have wanted intel on the various factions so that would require quite a few agents as well. Then you would get intel "brokers" (this would apply to neutral contries as well and to a limited extent some of the countries actually at war).

    If you look at the thread on the war in the Pacific game by the way you will note that most of the Chinese aircraft mentioned at the start of the war are of Soviet origin. The Germans also supplied weapons to the Chinese, at least prior to the formation of the Axis. I don't know all that much about China during this period myself but as with most things with China it was a very complex situation.

    If you are ony counting "foreign" spies then there's a good chance it would be one of the neutral countries, I'd put Spain and Sweden on the list as well though. Don't have any good idea what the numbers were in any of them though.
     
  12. gtblackwell

    gtblackwell Well-Known Member

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    Well my spies tell me Paris was the hotbed of espionage activity. Lots of French getting information out of the country and most had good cover, they lived there. Far too many were discovered but it seems like a spy center par excellence. Lots of top Germans there and others visiting plus cognac and companionship equals talk..

    Moi, mon général, je ne parle pas un mot d'allemand ......!
     
  13. Terry D

    Terry D Active Member

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    Shanghai, probably. See Bernard Wasserstein, The Secret War in Shanghai.
     

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