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Did Hitler want to win the war?

Discussion in 'WWII Today' started by JuanMaddox, Jan 15, 2020.

  1. James Stewart

    James Stewart Active Member

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    He undoubtedly did want to win the war and I dare say losing (probably) never really crossed his mind until things really went bad in 1943, ending the war was never in his agenda.
    Hitler was a gambler, as he attacked Russia and declared war on the USA his unseen enemy was time and he endeavored to defeat Russia before the USA could become involved, doing the same in North Africa, Russia, North Africa seeking to win before something happened in another theatre.
    Optimism and will may contribute in part to winning and instilling confidence but alone they won't win battles or alter circumstances which are based in more material and reality than the realms of expectation.
     
  2. wm.

    wm. Well-Known Member

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    Even? And who else? It seems they were lonely in their opinion.


    Nothing wrong with it.
    The Russians got a few pallets of money so they could buy themselves some "means of transport."
    It wasn't like they got a thousand Panthers and a nuclear bomb.
    There was nothing in the pact forbidding selling stuff to commies.
     
  3. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    Ah, so much for your
    Thanks for proving the opinions of the Japanese did not count at all.

    Nice minimizing...The Soviets, supposed "enemy", got more out of Germany during the short time of these agreements than Japan, supposed "ally", got out of Germany during their entire dealings with Nazi Germany.

    So much for the supposed German "ally."
     
  4. Arusha

    Arusha Member

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    ** Remember Hitler’s fixation on mysticism including numerology: 10 May 1940 versus 10 May 1941. The Rudolf Hess interrogation records will be unavailable to general public until 2040 and, Highly Likely, for ever and ever.
     
  5. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    Hitler did not have a fascination with mysticism...that was Himmler. Hitler often made fun of this fascination behind Himmler's back.
     
  6. James Stewart

    James Stewart Active Member

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    Jack , if I could recommend another of Ian Kershaw's work to you, "Fateful Choices". ( Ten Decisions That Changed The World 1940-1941.) Penguin / Allen Lane 2007. IMG_1881.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2020
  7. Arusha

    Arusha Member

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    The SWASTIKA and the Arian theory, can't separate that from Mr. Shiklgruber aka Adolf Hitler.
    "Nazism and occultism describes a range of theories, speculation and research into the origins of Nazism and its possible relation to various occult traditions. Such ideas have been a part of popular culture since at least the early 1940s, during World War II, and gained renewed popularity starting in the 1960s. There are documentaries and books on the topic, among the most significant are The Morning of the Magicians (1960) and The Spear of Destiny (1972). Nazism and occultism has also been featured in numerous films, novels, comic books and other fictional media. Some good examples are the film Raiders of the Lost Ark (1981) and the comic book series Hellboy.

    Historian Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke analyzed the topic in The Occult Roots of Nazism in which he argued there were in fact links between some ideals of Ariosophy and Nazi ideology. He also analyzed the problems of the numerous popular occult historiography books written on the topic. He sought to separate empiricism and sociology from the modern mythology of Nazi occultism that exists in many books which "have represented the Nazi phenomenon as the product of arcane and demonic influence". He considered most of these to be "sensational and under-researched."

    I can also understand the above text may qualify for a kind of BLA-BLA talk, yet, that all is part of Nazism per se. Primarily, can't separate Hitler and Himmler regardless of mockery exercises, whatever; such things as mysticism happen to all dictators except for one: J.S., and again, he had received theological education. There is a particular story he shared after visiting his mother who lived in GORI, a small urban community in Georgia. She asked him who he was; he tried to explain using the language she could understand. Therefore, he told her he was "The Tsar". She paused for a second, and then said, "You should have better made a priest." She died in 1937, aged 79. He didn't attend her burial ceremony due to purges in progress; no news about her death was posted.




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    Last edited: Jan 30, 2020
  8. Arusha

    Arusha Member

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    Fullness of Days, 1957; p. 212:

    “On August 21st a cryptic message was received from Germany suggesting, that Göring should come over to London, provided that he could be assured that he would be able to see the Prime Minister. After discussion it was decided to send an affirmative answer to this curious suggestion, and arrangement were accordingly set in hand for Göring to come over secretly on Wednesday, August 23rd. The idea was, that he should land at some disused aerodrome, be picked up in a car and taken direct to Chequers. There the regular household was to be given congé for two or three days and the telephone was to be disconnected while the visit took place. No answer, however, came till Thursday August 24th, when a message was received to the effect that Hitler did not think it would be immediately useful.”

    “Dear Mr. Cotton,
    I write this note to say that if your friend comes over soon the Prime Minister and I who have both already met him shall be glad to see him. Yours Sincerely, Halifax.”
     
  9. ItaliaLegion

    ItaliaLegion Member

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    This whole notion based on the equisyntial theories publicated by Western education and media is absurd that Germany wanted to conquer the world, or that if Germany won they would try conquering United States of America.. These are just post war propagandist tall tails to ensure people view the National Socialist as a threat to all human existence.

    Italy and Japan was the one trying to grab land that had no ethnic purpose.
    Italy tried to take Greece . Hitler only helped Italy's endeavor to Greece once he had thought of a 4th Reich . But the idea of 4th Reich was a niche idealistic analogue of a new formation of a Roman Empire thus the 4th Reich idealist were mainly military romantic that had pondered into the conceptions of Italy and Germany becoming one Nation with two leaders one , being Mussolini the other being Hitler. This sublimation of 4th Reich was originally designed as a creation of grabbing land that once belonged to Italy/Roman Empire and fusing it with the some Southern European Germanic lands thus creating a new Reich , only under the new Reich would you see Italian Roman historic involvement.
    So in purely imformed terms based on years of research I conclude that if Germany had won the war they would have taken Parts of Western Europe, Eastern Europe , and Southern Europe. Therefore this is a form of European enterprises that are in the everlasting domain of the Italian and German people. The poster child political idealogs of 21 century have no idea what Germany and Italy had attended for Europe. These Political frontmen for the 21st century post war educational propaganda on Western Nations , have included the most bias and apprehensive conclusions to why Hitler did not win is 90% conflated to the question "what if Germany had won". It is a alarmist mindset to what post war literature has created in the text books and written publications as to why Americans view Germany as the existential threat to North America.
    If Hitler had won the war , America would still be America and Germany would have created a new Visigothic Empire fused with Roman Italian Kingdoms of conquest.
    What you would see today if Germany and Italy had won , would be a new formality of a Greater European map that would show all of Southern and Eastern Europe under Italian and German rule , and you would not see Western European States under German rule or Italian rule because Germany and Italy would not want to partake in such land grabs into northern and Western Europe because the idealistic view some nationsof Western Europe is that it is a sanctimonious everlasting political stalemate between Slavic and Nothern Europeans who all accepted proto-habitism as their everlasting choice into "European acceptance " (To acknowledge their European ancestial roots and to boycott American acceptualism ).

    There would be no major threat to Germany or Italy because there are many nations in Europe that are at war with communism and the entirely of economic manufacturing is the key role to survival so the surrounding Western European States I believe with all my knowledge would indeed start economic trade with Italy and Germany if Hitler had won thus giving Hitler and Mussolini the informative economic factual evidence that Germany and Italy would in fact settle with trade with Sweden and Switzerland .

    Hitler indeed taken over France but you have to realize that France was split into 2 parts before Germany had invaded.
    So Germany was in lines with Vichy French Government. The Free French Forces did contest to Germany. But Germany had used compitulation to take full power of all of French domains. Including some pockets of Northern France were inlined with Hitler's political and military agreements with France.
    Important note : The compitulation accord between France and Germany was not take all of France but to take a part of Eastern France that would be 7000 miles of land between the coast stretching into southern Vichy France thus Germany had control of some major cities in France and the free grass lands of Vichy French would be used for military air fields.

    Therefore Germany and Vichy France were now in power of most of France not including the Northern France.
    But important to understand that this accord to French power was only a partial limited agreement that Germany would stay in Northern France until communism was defeated and indeed Northern and Central France will be returned to the rightful owners when the war is over but South Eastern France would become apart of the 3rd Reich.
    This plan was created by Himmler and Hitler before the war.


    So one can say the Free French Forces had corrupted African leadership in politics.
    It was concluded that Hitler and Germany was indeed helping West Africa regain some well earned ground in the resistance against Free French Military which again , was not apart of the Axis powers.
    Hitler was at war with not just communist but the Free French Army and Great Britain .
    So he had multiple fronts to fight in.
    Hitler underestimated the time the war took to complete. Hitler imagined the war will only have lasted 2 years. Hitler's German Army was not prepared for a 4-5 year world war.

    Hitler assumed that his enemies would compitulate to a table agreement of some sort.

    Hitler underestimated the Waffen SS .
    If Hitler would've allowed Non-Germanic foreignors to enlist in the 1930's and not just 1943 and beyond you would see a much bigger formation of the Waffen SS.
    If Hitler put full trust into Foreign recruits of the SS to be stationed in the heart of Germany you would have indeed seen a very different out come . And indeed you would have witness Italian 29th Waffen Grenadier of the SS troops and 21st Waffen of the SS Albanian troops defend Germany plus the many foreign Corps's / Fighting Forces of Wehrmatch like the Free Arabian Legion and Free Indian Legion and the Azerbaijani Legion of the Wehrmatch fight for Germany in 1944-1945. This I believe would change things radically to the point where you would have think tanks in the U.S. at the time suggest that Germany be nuked just like Japan. A Nuke to Germany would indeed end the German war machine but you would have to nuke Italy as well.

    My final conclusion .
    There is no correct answer to why Hitler supposedly did not want to win the war or a question of "Why Hitler lost" also has no correct or incorrect answer thus this question is uniquely a suggestion adverb to what is the prospects of approval for those whom believe Hitler had lost the war because it was good vs evil and the good guys "Great Britain and USA and Russia " we're some how justified in defeating Germany and Italy.

    We are now living in a world simply based on the winners of wars who all get to re-write history and deem whoever they want as the bad guys .
    So any question of Hitler is to be placed under the section of vulgarity conflated with evilness and malevolent in the subject matter to induce a sense of horror in the reader who views any question about Hitler.
     
  10. ItaliaLegion

    ItaliaLegion Member

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    Look into tge Thule Society.
    Beware those who read about the Thule Society's leader will soon realize National Socialist had a master plan to combined Islam with new future Reich's to ensure extreme radical fanatics to then help bolster push National Socialism throughout Eastern Europe. Hitler wanted Islam to take over the Balkan States of Eastern Europe. Hitler is also quoted saying " If Germany was a Mohammadin country , Germany would never be invaded because muslims are always ready to sacrafice them selves in time of war.
     
  11. ItaliaLegion

    ItaliaLegion Member

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    Look into tge Thule Society.
    Beware those who read about the Thule Society's leader will soon realize National Socialist had a master plan to combined Islam with new future Reich's to ensure extreme radical fanati
    The British stabbed Europe in the back by allowing British communist party in Great Britain use it's campaign donations to fund Communist Gurrelas in Spain in 1930's. British secret underground intelligent sectors of government in the 1920's and 1930's had funded communist gurrelas in Spain in a attempt to subvert the Spanish Government.
    In 1934 Great Britain's secret intelligence chief ordered secret covert funding operations to Communist insurgent freedom fighters in Spain to fight Franco's Fascist military. Great Britain again in 1936-1941 had also funded Communist resistant fighters in Slovenia to fight against the Italians.
     
  12. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    ..those dang Brits!!
     
  13. ItaliaLegion

    ItaliaLegion Member

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    Yo
    Yes indeed. Did you know Great Britain's power structure to defeat the "Nazi's" during WWII was comprised of British Secret Societies that were at war with German secret societies. Thus both sides were using black magic . Great Britain was using the Talmudic book (Hebrew Book designed for witchcraft and summoning demons)
    and Germany was using Visigothic Runic Symbolism mixed with spiritual channeling of past Germanic Kings .
     
  14. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    but there is no such thing as demons/etc
    ..I think the Russians had a lot to do with defeating Germany
     
  15. ItaliaLegion

    ItaliaLegion Member

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    The Russian played a key role in the invasion into Germany.
    But I think Stalin was entirly evil and he was even quoted saying to Winston Churchill "while you have God on you're side , I have the devil on my side ".
     
  16. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    Winning the western front so fast made Hitler change his plans and I think it was Paulus who was running the offensive games to win the war in the east. Stalin expected that Germany would be stuck to trench war for years like WW1.
     

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