Welcome to the WWII Forums! Log in or Sign up to interact with the community.

Prinz Eugen In 1945

Discussion in 'What If - European Theater - Western Front & Atlan' started by Shuttlelover101, Feb 4, 2010.

  1. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    Carronade,
    Aren't the breech Blocks to big??? And how Much do the weight???
    Nikki
     
  2. Carronade

    Carronade Ace Patron  

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    2,546
    Likes Received:
    456
    This link illustrates breech blocks:

    Breech Mechanisms

    The German 20.3cm SK C/34 gun used a horizontal sliding block. Just based on the weight of steel I would guess 100-200lb. It's a moving part, easy enough to remove with the proper equipment.
     
  3. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    Carronade,
    thanks for that! that was cool! How big were PG Shell, I know they were 280cm but how long were they?? the the tip of the shell back??
    Nikki
     
  4. Carronade

    Carronade Ace Patron  

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    2,546
    Likes Received:
    456
    PE's guns were 203mm or 8". The 280mm (not cm) or 11" were on the "pocket battleships" like the Graf Spee. The length of shells was about four times their diameter. If I recall correctly PE's 8" shells weighed about 256lb.

    I enjoy chatting with you, but if you want to dig into this stuff a I suggest you also try sources like google or wikipedia, you can find a lot of info very quickly and easily.
     
  5. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    Carronade,
    i don't know that, i was thing MM and CM were the same thing? i was thing that were the same thing???
    Nikki
     
  6. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    9,713
    Likes Received:
    1,501
    Nikki, you may find this link of some use, check all the sections not just the "length" lead-in spot.

    See:

    Fias Co Farm- Measurments, Conversion Guides, Charts & Calculators

     
  7. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    Clint,
    Thanks for that! what get me the most about PG, was the Fact that she stilled by Bismarck side, in the Denmark straits fight!!!
    Nikki
     
  8. lwd

    lwd Ace

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Messages:
    12,312
    Likes Received:
    1,232
    Location:
    Michigan
    This site is also good for a lot of naval info:
    NavWeaps - Naval Weapons of the World - 1880 to Present
    For instance if you want to see why some are not impressed with the German 8" gun compare:
    German 20.3 cm/60 (8") SK C/34
    to
    USA 8"/55 (20.3 cm) Marks 12 and 15
     
  9. TiredOldSoldier

    TiredOldSoldier Ace

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2008
    Messages:
    3,223
    Likes Received:
    451
    A picture is worth a thousand words. At that range I give 95% chance of 20.000 tonns of cruisers at the bottom of the Baltic and a couple of thousand wasted lives.
    Fortunately nobody was that crazy.
    Note that Devonshire is in her late war six gun configuration.


    [​IMG]
     

    Attached Files:

  10. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    TiredOldSoldier,
    I love that photo! Was Denonshire next to her the hole time or did they let her get up ahead or no?
    Nikki
     
  11. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    guys,
    going back to this for a minute, what do you guys really thing: If Prinz Eugen was able to escape from Dido, Devonshire, Iroqoois, Savage? How would she fair again the 10 heavy weight of the US Navy: North Carolina, Washington, South Dakota Indiana, Massachusetts, Alabama, Iowa, New Jersey, Wisconsin, Missouri and that's only if she had the legs to get out to japan or would they (Dido, Devonshire, Iroqoois, Savage) trap her long before then? What you guys thing and explain it to me ok.. IF she did get out there(Pacific), i didnt went her getting in to a fight with these 10 ships. but could they (North Carolina, Washington, South Dakota Indiana, Massachusetts, Alabama, Iowa, New Jersey, Wisconsin, Missouri) Corner her and what would happened then and EXPLAIN it to me? my think with them just trapping her, and either, the four Iowa's take her back to britain, or the ten take her to a US Naval Base!
    Nikki
     
  12. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    9,713
    Likes Received:
    1,501
    The powerplant was too unreliable, her legs were too short and slow, and the armor was too weak to take on much over the Heavy Crusiers which were newer in the Allied Navies, and she wouldn't have to be "taken on and encircled" by larger ships or forces.

    It was a pretty ship (as were a number of the Italian designs), but it just wasn't a competitive ship by post-1941. If it had "escaped" into the Pacific, it would have still ended up on the bottom in that ocean as it did historically.
     
  13. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    brndirt1,
    IF she did get out there(Pacific), I didnt went her getting in to a fight with these 10 ships. but could they (North Carolina, Washington, South Dakota Indiana, Massachusetts, Alabama, Iowa, New Jersey, Wisconsin, Missouri) Corner her and what would happened then and EXPLAIN it to me? my think with them just trapping her, and either, the four Iowa's take her back to britain, or the ten take her to a US Naval Base!
    Nikki
     
  14. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    9,713
    Likes Received:
    1,501
    If she fought, she would be sunk. No question. If she surrendered, she would be towed to an allied base. She wasn't fast or reliable enough to escape, she wasn't strong enough to fight.
     
  15. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    Guys,
    My thing with these ten ships is, have North Carolina, Washington coming in from Behind, along with South Dakota! then have Indiana, Massachusetts, Alabama come in from the front! with Iowa New Jersey coming in on her from her Port side, with Wisconsin, Missouri coming in on her from the starboard side) what do you thing? then you have Dido, Devonshire, Iroqoois, Savage, waiting in the wings if she chooses to run! then what?
    Nikki
     
  16. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    9,713
    Likes Received:
    1,501
    Why bother? A single USN Heavy Cruiser from 1941 teamed with a pair of DDs would deal with the Prince E. with no problem. She cannot run (bad propulsion systems), and only a sprint speed of 32+ knots she cannot maintain. Slow, under armed, under armored, and unreliable ship dies or surrenders. Game over.

    You are just not going to come up with any scenerio in which the Prince Eugen does anything more than it did. Surrender or die.
     
  17. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    brndirt1,
    So what are you trying to tell me, she deadmeat either way, as in she runs or dosent run? o, i just got in the The RC warships, and i have a friend who has PG, as an RC model! her is a photo of her and two of the hull, for Prinz Eugen! let me know what you guys thing ok!, and i was going to start a thread, but if you went i can leave it in here ok!
    Nikki
     

    Attached Files:

  18. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    9,713
    Likes Received:
    1,501
    Yeah, pretty much "dead meat". She was a beautiful ship without doubt, sort of a "scaled down" Bismarck if you will. But, much like the lovely Italian warships, not really as good as their appearance let on.

    If caught outside of a port, I wouldn't doubt that the crew would scuttle her, the Germans had a reputation of doing that remember. The entire WW1 Fleet while it sat in Scapa Flow, and the Graf Spee off the River Platte. The scuttling of the Bismarck is still debated, but I wouldn't doubt that they did that too. Old habits are hard to break.

    I think that completed one is a lovely model, you should post a similar set of pics over in the models thread section. Thanks for the glimpse here if you haven't already put them up there.
     
  19. Shuttlelover101

    Shuttlelover101 Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2008
    Messages:
    57
    Likes Received:
    1
    What do you mean by this: I think that completed one is a lovely model, you should post a similar set of pics over in the models thread section. Thanks for the glimpse here if you haven't already put them up there.
    Nikki
     
  20. brndirt1

    brndirt1 Saddle Tramp

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2008
    Messages:
    9,713
    Likes Received:
    1,501
    The RC one afloat on the water is a lovely model is all. I like the paint scheme the owner used on it. I assumed that the unfinished hull you posted was one which wasn't finished yet, or was it the same model in its early stages?

    And you have seen the "models" section haven't you? It is in the "activities and hobbies" section of the forum.
     

Share This Page