Secondary weapons for snipers?

”The term "sniper" comes after WWII. During WWII they are referred too as “Sharpshooters."

What , I don’t think so.

Major Hesketh Vernon Hesketh-Prichard (1876-1922);…. Securing a commission in the British Army with the outbreak of war in Europe in 1914 Hesketh-Prichard was given the decidedly unusual post of 'sniping expert' to the British Third Army the following year;……..He initiated the inaugural sniper course entitled "The First Army School of Sniping, Observing and Scouting";…..Having attained his aim of boosting the presence and accuracy of British sniping (along with Major F. M. Grunt of the King's Royal Rifles) Hesketh-Prichard published his wartime memoirs, ‘Sniping in France’, in 1920.

”Sniper comes from a play on words by British soldiers in India as early as 1773. Here troops hunted the Snipe, a small, quick bird that was difficult to shoot. Successful shooters were dubbed Snipers.

No.9

 

The official U.S. Army Sniper School was not implemented until the early 1970's. The U.S. Army had no official "snipers" during WWII they were referred too as "sharpshooters."

The term "Sniper" therefore is not referable to all armies of WWII. Careful!

Regards,
MARNE

 

Marne,

The main idea of the secondary weapon here is that you can cover yourself when you´re found and the enemy is trying to kill you by sending troops after you. By then fire power in some way is needed, I think, because once you´re found being silent does not help anymore that much.

 

"The term "Sniper" therefore is not referable to all armies of WWII. Careful!"

Moi . I was not the one who proclaimed "during WWII there were no "snipers." ? Then again not all armies were in WWII in 1939

No.9

 

At the time that I made that comment I thought you were relating it to U.S. "Sharpshooters".. on the British end of that note I stand corrected. However, it does not prove the fact that ALL were "snipers." Simply stated "armies of the time period referred to them simply as either 'Snipers' or "Sharpshooters."

On another note...don't even dispute the fact whether or not the U.S. military was or wasn't there you'll lose that argument. We put over 10,000,000 U.S. Military personnel into the entire of WWII alone. Quite a feat to become No. 1 in military size from No. 36 in 1940.

Regards,
MARNE

 

Yeah, I've seen that film.

No.9

 

I'd take a Sten MK-IIs (Silenced version of the Sten MK-II)
It would be good for taking out one or two people without drawing even more attention to yourself.

 

Let me inject a dose of reality into this.

First, the typical "sniper" of the WW II era was a squad member. He would normally carry a selected, somewhat higher quality rifle otherwise similar to or the same as the rest of his squad. He would also have a 4 to 10 power scope (there is alot of variation here between nations) on the rifle.
He may or may not have had special training. Most didn't; they simply were the best shot in their training company or such. Training such as it was, showed them how to target to about 400 yards with reasonable accuracy.
As far as equipment, they otherwise carried the same gear as the rest of their squad. Toting a second weapon, particularly something using different ammunition and weighing several pounds wasn't going to happen. The last thing a soldier loaded down with 50 to 70 lbs of gear who walks everywhere he goes wants is 5 to 8 more pounds of ammo and gun he rarely, if ever, will use.
This is particularly true since "snipers" worked as part of their squad and would have had "cover" from their squad mates.
On the whole, I think someone here has been playing a few too many first person shooter video games.......

 

If I were a sniper I wouldn't want to tote around a sub-machinegun with ammunition in addition to my rifle with the rifle ammuniton and all of the other necesseties carried by an infantryman. I think the most practical thing would be to carry a sidearm. I think I would prefer a .45 with a couple magazines. Now that combination of weaponry is practical AND powerful.

 

Well said, T.A.!

In the U.S. Army, I know for a fact that the U.S. Armed Forces didn't have everything modernized; their company build up was still 80 years behind in most cases. They were still basing their companies off the old system of a company of the American War Between The States. The only real thing that had changed was the squad automatic rifleman with a B.A.R. and his assistant.

This is also hence why "Snipers" in the U.S. Army are still referred to as "Sharpshooters." A "Sniper" has special training in concealment, movement, navigation...hes kind of a one man squad. However, a "Sharpshooter" has no special training and works in coordination with the rifle squad, as he is a part of the individual rifle squad himself.

As for a "Sniper/Sharpshooter" having a 4-10 power scope isn't always true. I've talked to a number of actual "Sharpshooters" from the 1st, 3rd, and 9th Inf. Divisions and they told me that they were issued them but, they shortly thereafter got rid of them because they 1.) didn't collect enough light, 2.) they weighed a 1/2 pd. to a 1 1/2 pds., and 3.) Europe was heavily populated and they rarely got into a "Sharpshooter" vs. "Sharpsooter" combat action at more than 300 yds. and if Marines in WWI can hit germans at a range of 700 yds. with iron sights then a good shooting "Sharpshooter" can hit his target at the same distance in the same manner. So as you can see scopes aren't necessarily always with the individual "Sharpshooter".

However, if like I stated in my first post in this thread I wouldn't carry a .45 pistol. Mainly because with its ammunition it weighs overall almost 2 pds.. However, if I were to carry a M-1918/M3 Trench/Fighting knife it'd be lighter and handier in a pinch. Plus it'd be quieter.

Pretty much the "Sniper/Sharpshooter" of the Second World War was a "gravel-aggitater" like the rest of his squad mates.

Regards,
MARNE

 

You don't have much range with a Trench knife Marne. Unless you're handy at throwing one. And that's it; you only get one shot. What if there are two hostiles advancing upon your position? I think I would feel a bit safer knowing that that extra two pounds at my hip could mean the difference between life and death.

 

Well, a o number one with a M-1918 Trench knife I can punch, cut or jab with a trench knife I can't really do all of that with a M-1911A1. All I can do is pull the trigger and I only have seven shots no more, no less. Granted its handy in a pinch but, I really don't need one if I have another 11 men around me, now do I?!

As a sharpshooter in a squad I have twelve men including myself. They give me the time to make my shots thats why their there. They give me the time to surgically cut down and do the most damage to the enemy to soften them up for them. Sharpshooter/ Snipers during WWII do not act on their own they are a part of a squad. The squad is why they don't need an extra 2 pounds of pistol on their hip. Not to mention each individual sharpshooter has his own methods of concealment as well.

Regards,
MARNE

 

I'd take a Welrod, the silenced pistol with the six round magazine that the OSS and SOE used. It was almost totally silent and less than 3lbs empty, so it wouldn't weigh the sniper down all that much.

 

Sepp Allerberger: Sniper on the eastern front

Sepp mentioned in his book that once you are found out the enemy starts firing with mortars and every possible heavy weapon at you so according to him you better start running zig-zag away from your position. Those who stay will be dead soon. That´s what Sepp said. As he survived I´d follow his advice.....

 

Kai this book sounds great. I looked it up online about a week ago after reading your reccomendation and when I finish up my current read I am definitely buying this.

 

Dont kid yourself Marne. A 7 bulleted pistol is better even than a baynrtt. Even if you can stab someone with it 20 times. But Id recon a side arm is realy for phycology. Making someone feel safer.

Id also like to say, a gun at yory hib means a belt around your waist. Belt means buckle, buckle means jingle.

As for me, if I could, 45. auto.

 

Indeed Miller! Great book! I have never read a true story from the battleground so this is excellent reading.

Also when sniping one must recall it just might be you who´s been followed. Sepp once had watched the whole day what happens in the Soviet area and did not find anything "nice" to shoot and relaxed for a while. And then the sniper shoot his boot´s heel off and almost his foot as well...You can never be sure really it seems.