The best general of the eastern front?

Walter Model has an undeserved reputation.

His performance at Kursk was laughable for someone supposedly at the top of his game. He rode the back of the Army's pechant for defensive counterattack. This most difficult of all infantry actions was something Das Heer did quite well enough on their own, without Model's 'assistance'.

Model failed at Arnhem, too, but had his chestnuts pulled from the fire by the tenacity and dogged determination of General Wilhelm Bittrich. Left to Model, a withdrawl was in the offing for the 9th and 10th SS divisions, but Bittrich dug his heals in and hung on for the win.

In fact, I can't recall even a single offensive action where Walter Model made a significant impact on the general course of the war. Vastly overrated.

 

Shaposhnikov also gets my vote for incredible staff work in the midst of utter chaos.

But, the real 'strong man' of the Eastern Front, the man whose actions had the most far-reaching consequences on the course of the war was none other than NIKITA KHRUSCHEV.

Before his arrival at the Stalingrad 'front', all was despair and retreat. Nikita gave the city and it's defenders BACKBONE for the gruelling test ahead that Zhukov had seen coming. Khrushchev's harsh words and piggy-eyed gaze inspired none other than Rodmistrev's 13th Guard unit to practically swim across the Volga and conduct an offensive action that managed to grind the German offensive to a complete standstill for the time being. Rodmistrev was a firebrand frontline commander, and he was exactly where he was needed at the time to put the fear of God into the German assault. Chuikov used his men to buy time by throwing them into assaults that were straight at the teeth of the 6th Army. Simply defending was not enough....Chuikov knew that the German formations must be kept well and truly off balance, not allowing them pause to regroup, but forcing them to throw tired and depleted formations into battle time and again to regain the initiative that Chuikov was stealing from them.

Stalingrad was 'Total War' before the term became into common use.

Commanders like Nikita Khrushkev took tough decisions, letting their own 62nd Army wither on the vine just long enough for Zhukhov to strike. And Zhukhov was the past master of recognizing the moment to switch fromstrategic defence to offence. He had pulled that trick out of the bag at Moscow the year before, timing to perfection the December offensive for the exact moment when German offensive power had spent itself. Georgi certainly ground down his own frontline formations, but a good commander will always have a reserve pool to throw into the ring for a decisive move.

 

After all the Generals were named here´s my favourite: He had no own troops but he commandedall no matter if Russian or German. When he decided to stop all movements of the troops, they didn´t move. He killed a lot of soldiers on both sides and not a single technical development could really stop him. Curios, it is "General Winter" feared at both sides for the freezing temperatures, winterstorms and so on. A bit ironic.

 

Code:

 Cant say that I have heard Zhukov crying either Surprised me too! 

Obviously you have not read the book which is much more concerned with the characters concerned than inimate details of the campaign. However, S-M is very good with the citations and managed to get interviews with people very close to Stalin (or their offspring). Gives a real insight not only into Stalin and his henchmen but many of the military commanders as well. 


Will need to dig around a bit (large book)but when I find the info I will post it.  

Here are the relevant page\s:

View attachment 13832


I should add that S-M gives over 50 pages of references - these are extended with more detail on his website Simon Sebag Montefiore - Stalin above is page 378 to 381. (wish other historians would do the same and then we could all form our own view on the realiability of the info)

Apologies for posting on this thread - don't really know enough to comment and when I check Zukov didn't want to be Chief of Staff and the mega mistake was of Stalin's making.

 

http://i1105.photobucket.com/albums/h354/HFGEL/Zukov2.png?t=1312579012

http://i1105.photobucket.com/albums/h354/HFGEL/Zukov1.png?t=1312579461

Sorry realised you can't read the thumbnails - so here are some links

 

For the Soviets, it has to be Vasilevsky, the man who helped plan all the Soviet victories. Unknown to most, Vasilevsky was Stalins chief planner and advisor, he never got the praise Zhukov did, but he was a strategic thinker at least as good as Manstein.

 

Thank you for the links Scipio and an interesting read. I am familiar with the incident but other sources which I have read dont state that Zhukov "ran out in tears", so I am suspect. None the less, thats not to say that such did not occur.

 

Slon,

So to be the best you had to fight in Russia? I disagree. But I would ask that you educate me as to this system the Germans were using where they sent the best to Russia.

 

Hello IntIron,

The Eastern Front was Germany's biggest threat and would ultimately decide her fate. It was because the Eastern front was Germany's priority; logically it would seem that Germany would send all that she could to Russia first. It is precisely for this reason why the best of the best would generaly be sent to the Ost Front.

Afterall, how can you be the best if you havent faced the worst?

 

From Soviet part:

Rokossovsky - the great moments of this general are:
1. after torture he decided nevertheless to fight at all heart.
2. The defense of Elnya - no army, no divisions - he stopped the Army Gruop Center advance for a critical time. So good management of virtually non-existent forces.
3. The defense of Moskow.
4. The North part of the Kusrk battle - excellent defense and surprise art. attack.
4. Operation Bagration.
5. The maneuver war in North Germany in 1945.
He was also early adept and developer of tank warfare concepts, together with Touhachevsky.

Katukov - the russian tank general, which invented the tactics: how to stop Guderian. (Battles for Orel and Tula). Also promimnent during the Kusrk battle. He was the first to discover how exactly to use T-34 and KV-1 in defense and counter-attack, without giving too much casualties. The lack of proper tactics until october 1941 hindered their use in the Soviet Army.

From the German part:

Guderian - inventor of combined arms-tank-blitzkrieg tactics. Perfect army commander at the begining of the war. Prominent chief of the OKH and general-inspector of the tank forces after the begining of the 1943. He fight the end part of teh war with infarctus - uuf.

Mansetin, for the initial nothern advance of the war, Perekop-Sevastopol&Kerch peninsula battle. Eavding of the collapse of the Army Group South in 1943.

Generals Balk and Hot - tank generals, capable many times to do the impossible.

The harsh winter conditions, rasputica, distances and etc. are EASY predictable conditions - they are not excuses. Even the example of Napoleon Bonapart shows clearly the need to be careful to logistics.

I evade to propose Zhukov, because of the fail of operation "Mars" in 1943 - here Model has had the upper hand and the Soviet casualties where really enormous because of planning, logistics and execution.

 

For the German side, nobody has mentioned Generaloberst Erhard Rauss. Guderian and Manstein considered him one of the best panzer commanders of the war. He commanded 6th pz div and then rose to command the 4th Pz armee and then the 3rd. After the war he wrote several monographs for the American Army Historical Section.

 

I don't know why ya'all are so taken by the career of Walter Model.

The German Army in Russia proved time and again that conducting a defensive operation whilst withdrawing was their forte'. Model's reputation as a general rested with just this. "The Fuhrer's Fireman" gained his defensive "victories" on the back of such expertise as the German Army possessed without him. So scratch that.

Model was a total failure at Kursk. His northernpincer went precisely nowhere, and his use of the new 'Elefant' tank destroyers as assault vehicles beggars description of him as a competent offensive commander. Defending is always going to be an easier task than taking the offensive and gaining ground. So scratch that too.

Model's arrival on the western front for Arnhem could have gone terribly sour if his advice was followed. It was up to SS General Wilhelm Bittrich to pull his nuts out of a sel-imposed fire, (Ha ha! The 'Fireman' with a fire he couldn't put out!). Bittrich not only saved the day and stopped the offensive by sheer tenacity, he also did it with a pair of divisions that were badly in need of a rest and refit. Sterling performance from Bittrich, terrible from Model. Scratch that as well.

Added to all of this was Model's propensity for his unswerving loyalty to Hitler and the regime. Can't call a man brilliant for that either.

All in all, I think a good look at the record shows Walter Model as FAR from 'the best'. There were many other generals on the Eastern Front on both sides who did their utmost despite the situations they found themselves in. Names like Balch, Hoth, Rokossovsky, Dovator, all these people qualify.

Walter Model was vin ordinaire.....

 

The German defensive doctrine was Hitler´s "Not a step back". I think you can count the number of surrounded troops several times after Stalingrad, even Häusser almost lost his head when he took the SS panzer Corps out of Kharkov 1943 and made Manstein´s backhand slap possible. Simply the Germans ended in Siberia not withdrawing towards Fatherland. Model or no Model the same for every German general. Looking for a German General who was allowed to retreat, that´s a hard question. Maybe better for the war to end sooner...

 

Vasilevski has to be among the best, he waas the main planner for the Stalingrad offence, Kursk, Bagration and the attack into Manchuria

 

Manstein on the German side.
Rokkosovsky or Tobulkin (both of whom tend to be underrated) on the Red Army side.

 

Why no mention of Malinovsky???? And what attributes and battles were Tolbukhin renowned for. I am pretty well read, but he doesn't get much attention from many authors.

What sets Rokosovsky apart from the author Red Amry marshalls???

 

Soviet tankers had a bloodletting during and after 1941.Hey guys,I seem to recall in the readers digest'history of ww2",a section concerning the year of ten victorys.Theres a piece in there of a very young Soviet Tank General,I cannot think of his name,but he must of inspired his men and honed their tactics,seems like he'll be my choice.People do not discuss soviet armoured tactics enough IMO.Cheers,Lee.

 

Hey guys,Apolgies.I missed a post a few back.Cheers,Lee.

 

Thanks for the correction. I thought Paulus was a "von" also.

 

There is no such thing as a best general