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Tigers in the Ardennes ..

Discussion in 'Western Europe 1943 - 1945' started by sniper1946, Oct 30, 2010.

  1. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    Is Mr. Degbomont's account of the injuries to Neuman and the other crewman accurate? Did 105 fire a shot after taking the hit on the mantle?
     
  2. SS-501

    SS-501 New Member

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    I actually hadn't seen the "reflex" shot reported before ... it's plausible, but I don't recall that Wessel or Belbe said it.

    Best,
    Greg
     
  3. SS-501

    SS-501 New Member

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    For those on Facebook, I put up a book page about "Tigers in the Ardennes." The page will have photos not included in the book, along with new info recently discovered.

    http://www.facebook.com/TigersintheArdennes


    Best,
    Greg
     
  4. MarcusB

    MarcusB New Member

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  5. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    I have the book pre-ordered on Amazon. It was supposed to be available on 28 January, but Amazon has notified me that the book is delayed for unknown reasons.
     
  6. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    Quite often happens with Schiffer books......
     
  7. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    I've kept the pre-order open. Looking forward to it whenever it shows up... Unfortunately, you have to take steps to keep the order open when there is a delay, so the author is likely losing sales. That's too bad, but it's in the publishers hands and there isn't much that can be done by the writer.
     
  8. FalkeEins

    FalkeEins Member

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  9. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Attached Files:

    George Patton and Ruud like this.
  10. MarcusB

    MarcusB New Member

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    Still hoping if someone can give an impression of the inside, added with some pics would be really nice.
    Thanks!
     
  11. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    Amazon now has the book and my order has shipped!
     
  12. GunSlinger86

    GunSlinger86 Well-Known Member

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    The Pershing took out a Tiger during the end stages of the battle.
     
  13. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    The Pershing was knocked out, although later repaired and returned to service, by a Tiger I. The Tiger, in making it's escape, backed into a large pile of rubble and became immobilized. Also, the engagement took place during the night of February 26, 1945, after the Ardennes Offensive had ended.
     
  14. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    First customer review appeared on US Amazon today, so someone got their copy........
     
  15. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    Wow, Captain Leon Kent has passed. He was the man commanding the 90mm gun that knocked out Tiger 213. The La Gleize Tiger.

    http://www.latimes.com/local/obituaries/la-me-leon-kent-20150219-story.html

    His account of that fight can be found here: http://lcweb2.loc.gov/diglib/vhp-stories/loc.natlib.afc2001001.07607/transcript?ID=sr0001

     
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  16. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    It's interesting how much Captain Kent gets wrong. His account strikes me as being completely honest and straightforward, but with what we know today it shows how often first person accounts are wrong. People are exhausted and often get the details wrong, or misinterpret what they see.

    For example he thinks the strike just below the point on the bow penetrated the hull and killed the crew, when in fact it didn't. That hole is evident in many photos of the LaGlieze Tiger and of course it doesn't penetrate into the crew compartment. In fact, the crew bailed after the hit on the gun and survived that clash.
     
  17. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    Absolutely, and historians have to handle it with care. The 'Duel In The Mist' volume covering the 'tank battle' near Stoumont Station is fascinating about the three Panthers which are often claimed to have been knocked out in a straight fight with Shermans. They'd actually been knocked out/disabled by artillery - when the US armour advanced later in poor visibility they naturally saw Panthers and opened fire.......without realising they were abandoned.
     
  18. SS-501

    SS-501 New Member

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    Hello Marcus,

    I'll try to get permission from Schiffer to scan and post some pages; I don't know if that will be permitted, but I'll ask.

    I know several people who have the book on pre-order on Amazon that have gotten theirs, and others who haven't. I was told by a Barnes and Noble representative that it is in stock and can be ordered through barnesandnoble.com.

    Thanks for your interest!
    Greg
     
  19. SS-501

    SS-501 New Member

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    Is Captain Kent's account about fighting against the Tigers at the Werimont Farm at La Gleize, where 211 and 213 were both knocked out? I don't think there were any 90mm guns involved in that; just Shermans of TF McGeorge of the 3rd Armored Division. He may be talking about the fighting in Stoumont. The embedded round in the front armor of 213 measures approximately 75mm; IMO it was probably fired by a Sherman at close range as US tanks approached La Gleize, after the Germans had abandoned their positions.

    Best,
    Greg
     
  20. KodiakBeer

    KodiakBeer Member

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    The La Gleize Tiger (213) was the one with the end of the barrel shot off. Unless there was another Tiger (or Panther, Kent wasn't sure) with that damage I'd assume he was talking about that one. He could be mistaken - it's obvious from his account that he was basically thrown into the fray with little information or even a map. He didn't examine 213 until a day or two later, so it's entirely possible he thought these were tanks he engaged when in fact "his" tanks were closer to Stoumont.
     

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