Welcome to the WWII Forums! Log in or Sign up to interact with the community.

For Those Interested in Archaeology

Discussion in 'Free Fire Zone' started by GRW, Jan 19, 2009.

  1. GRW

    GRW Pillboxologist WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2003
    Messages:
    21,063
    Likes Received:
    3,239
    Location:
    Stirling, Scotland
    I would say instinctive, since we automatically mistrust anything strange for survival reasons. Letting go should be a learned concept.
     
    Biak likes this.
  2. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2010
    Messages:
    10,134
    Likes Received:
    3,417
    I would argue bias is completely natural…bias towards the self and the family and then the tribe…And so on. Bias is the brother of discrimination, both are natural and have helped us survive.
    As for social interaction..we are by far the most social of all the ‘group’ animals, we are communicating across the globe right now…We are a slave in terms of sex, that’s all creatures…but beyond that, even bonobos and chimpanzees are in our deep shade in terms of our social nature.
     
  3. Biak

    Biak Boy from Illinois Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    9,388
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    Now remember this is only my opinion. And I woke up at the ungodly hour of 5:12am so the coffee hasn't really kicked in yet.
    Our survival trigger is set from mistrust of other humans. If we were truly Intelligent we'd realize being less belligerent would be more helpful to ensure our survival. It's just an innate part of our DNA combining fear, greed, narcissism and the unwillingness to accept the fact the human race is inherently an violent so-called Civilization.
     
  4. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2010
    Messages:
    10,134
    Likes Received:
    3,417
    Darwin once said that most animals lived in fear and died young…this is the world we came from.
     
  5. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    Civilization? Great idea! ... Uh, when we gonna get one?
     
  6. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    "Bloody red in fang and claw." Sounds like my high school class.
     
  7. Biak

    Biak Boy from Illinois Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    9,388
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    Darwin is much like Hubble : I see it as this! And thus the masses follow.
    According to Darwin, Humans are no different than any other branch of living animal then?
    Humans are capable of spatial reasoning. We learn (occasionally) from the Past and perceive as best we can the Future. Less occasionally.
    Living in fear is solely a Human trait. Animals only become alarmed at immediate peril while we puny 'Us' live in dread.
     
  8. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    We're the high end of the animal world, making us the most dangerous animals.
     
    Biak likes this.
  9. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2010
    Messages:
    10,134
    Likes Received:
    3,417
    You always give me heaps to work with…
    I’m not sure what you mean by ‘no different’, the branches define difference.
    Humans have much less ‘number ones’ than most people think. There are insects and birds that have vastly better spatial awareness than us…All higher animals learn from experience…even cats and dogs.
    Our ability to predict the future beyond a couple of minutes is pretty woeful. Depends if you are talking your future or say the future of something in particular, like technology. Dragon flies can predict the future…they rely on it to catch fast flying insects…butterfly’s flutter about with no set course, putting off would be predators trying to predict their heading and where they will be when they close in…a dragon fly can even predict a butterfly’s course…
     
  10. Biak

    Biak Boy from Illinois Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    9,388
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    Catching a bug is similar to Skeet shooting. Or Deflection if your flying a Thunderbolt shooting a Zero. Aren't the Intellectuals forecasting the devastation of the melting ice caps ? Presumably in a few decades to a hundred years from now. Ya know, after we're all dead a gone.
     
    CAC likes this.
  11. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2010
    Messages:
    10,134
    Likes Received:
    3,417
    Darwin’s model has been tested time & again…it’s solid. But due to ‘time’ restrictions he couldn’t accurately give a time on how quickly these changes occur other than ‘when the environment changes’…We are slowly waking up to the idea of spontaneous evolution also.
    He himself recognised a problem with his general theory. He saw parrots for example that had super long tails…These tails were so big and heavy that it significantly slowed its flight and agility…Why would an animal develop something that made it ‘easier’ for predators to attack them?? Perplexed Darwin no end.
    He realised a secondary feature to evolution - Sexual evolution.
    These parrots wanted to attract a mate and have the best tail above all…these two imperatives, survival of the species vs survival of an individuals genes. We follow because it explains things pretty neatly and difficult to refute. As always an open mind is needed, or you miss everything.
     
  12. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    The evolutionary changes are usually microscopic or very small. Let's take zebras. Say predators see only the black part of a zebra's hide. If there is less black on one animal, and that is passed along to his/her offspring, they will have a slight edge over the original-patterned zebras. No guarantee that animal will live to reproduce or that their offspring will survive childhood to reproduce, but if all the hurdles are cleared then the somewhat new zebras will be more successful at avoiding predators. Not hugely better, evolution works in tiny increment most of the time. (A 'great leap forward' is something that happens so very rarely that we can go a life time without seeing one.)
     
  13. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    Melting of the ice caps will raise the sea levels. Buy land in Arizona.
     
  14. Biak

    Biak Boy from Illinois Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    9,388
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    I'm sitting at 1460' . I'll never see the Ocean from my door.

    Ps: Florida should already be under water.
     
  15. Biak

    Biak Boy from Illinois Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    9,388
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    Got a archaeology question I've pondered ;

    What kept the Native Americans from developing more advanced lifestyles. As we know "advanced lifestyle". Written language, more Agrarian, weapons ect: ?
     
  16. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    The art of metal working wasn't developed in the Western Hemisphere to any great extent. Metal working required smelters which aren't portable. The settled lifestyle follows from that, and research is possible at all levels when we didn't have to walk for hours just to find food.

    That's my short answer. Obviously other factors would be addressed, like raising crops, or extensively altering the environment. (Mesoamerican people created farms that were surrounded by water, making irrigation possible and increasing crop output.
     
  17. CAC

    CAC Ace of Spades

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2010
    Messages:
    10,134
    Likes Received:
    3,417
    The Indians did smelt copper…but the soft metal wasn’t good enough for weapons or tools, mostly jewellery. I would simply say that each ‘group’ develops at different speeds. A breakthrough here or there, or a meeting with someone afar, and the. Course of their history changes…
    I believe Europe developed due to living above the snow line, which required far more skill and knowledge than living in the valleys or warmer climates…This created more neural pathways making us generally smarter than those down in the valleys. New tools, new living arrangements, clothes and serious hunting skills were needed to live in the snow. Their development was sped up.
    But let’s not forget the Middle East, North Africa and China…our ancestors were digging for peat for our fires when these places were sitting on the third story building sipping tea, talking to their lawyer about a possible defamation case…
    We needed time and a catalyst to catch up…that came in the form of Rome.
     
    OpanaPointer likes this.
  18. Biak

    Biak Boy from Illinois Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2009
    Messages:
    9,388
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    I was thinking more among the lines of comparison to the Maya and Aztec . They built huge living complexes, developed a written language, were able to provide food for in some cases thousands of people. While others remained Nomads and were closer to the Clovis Era.
     
  19. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2008
    Messages:
    19,044
    Likes Received:
    5,948
    Remember where they found the Clovis point?
     
  20. GRW

    GRW Pillboxologist WW2|ORG Editor

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2003
    Messages:
    21,063
    Likes Received:
    3,239
    Location:
    Stirling, Scotland
    Well, the Scottish Iron Age is recognised as ending around the 8th Century AD, because a lot of the native Celtic tribes retreated back into the Highlands and the Atlantic coast as a response to the Roman presence. Their technology therefore stagnated for a long a time. The Middle Ages were well underway in the rest of Scotland by that point.

    Shades of Plato's cave analogy there!

    The Indus Valley civilisation had running water toilets 1,000 years before Rome though. And a lot of folk in Britain still burn Peat in the same way Indians burn dried cow pats. Some of it's just local availability, or plain old "this is the way we've always done it".
     
    CAC and OpanaPointer like this.

Share This Page