SS in the Luftwaffe?

I have noticed Reinhard Heydrich's uniform has a pilot's badge. I also read that he wanted an Iron Cross so bad that he flew until he got it. Question is, when did he do this and was he part of the SS at the time? I know he was in the Kriegsmarine first. Then joined the SS. This means that he flew while in service with the SS. Am I wrong. I have not read anything else. I know somebody else had a question about SS members in other branches of the armed forces.

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"They wrote in the old days that it is sweet and fitting to die for one's country. But in modern war there is nothing sweet or fitting in your dying. You will die like a dog for no good reason."

 

I know there were a small number of SS pilots assigned to fly Fiesler Storch type aircraft within the Waffen SS divisions, much as artillery observers flew Piper Cubs in the US Army.

 

Sorry to say, there were absolutely no Waffen SS in the Luftwaffe. There were however, some Waffen SS who were pilots as pointed out but they were not in any Luftwaffe unit. Also, there were a number of men who transfered from the Luftwaffe into the Waffen SS, and who had had some pilot training or were fully qualified. I do not remember where I read this but do remember that there was some sort of contreversy, as to wether this was true or not.

Many people also do not realize that the Kriegsmarine also had their own pilots, as did the U-boat service.

 

Yes, the mystery here is when did Heydrich get his Iron Cross? It does state he did while flying. But does not state flying for which branch. It was received after the war started but he was already in the SS. Oh, the mystery, the mystery.

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"They wrote in the old days that it is sweet and fitting to die for one's country. But in modern war there is nothing sweet or fitting in your dying. You will die like a dog for no good reason."

 

I dont know when he recieved his EK, it was probably given to him because of the way he handled his "little kingdom"

All kidding aside, he recieved it whilst in the SS, I just dont know for what or when it was awarded to him for, could have been because of his admin skills-since he wasnt a combat soldier.

I almost forgot, he was in the Abwehr for a time which was probably when and where and why he was awarded the decoration. Also, he did not get along with Admiral Canaris which I believe led him to his sinister choice of positions.

 

I will have to take a look at the book again, but I was reading that he received it while flying. Which also brings up the question of his pilots badge. I will let you know what I found.

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"They wrote in the old days that it is sweet and fitting to die for one's country. But in modern war there is nothing sweet or fitting in your dying. You will die like a dog for no good reason."

 

Dear PzJgr: Thank you, I could use more info on him, I appreciate it very much.

 

> Yes, the mystery here is when did
> Heydrich get his Iron Cross?


If I remember correctly, Heydrich was awarded his Iron Cross when he flew combat missions over the Eastern front. He was forbidden to continue this after he was shot down and had to be rescued.

/Marcus

 

So, then it is correct that we have an SS officer flying combat missions. Hmmm. Thanks Marcus

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"They wrote in the old days that it is sweet and fitting to die for one's country. But in modern war there is nothing sweet or fitting in your dying. You will die like a dog for no good reason."

 

Here is a link which states same. He flew missions over Russia at about 1940/41 time frame. After he had joined the SS.

http://www.netcomuk.co.uk/~plepage/biography.html

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"They wrote in the old days that it is sweet and fitting to die for one's country. But in modern war there is nothing sweet or fitting in your dying. You will die like a dog for no good reason."

 

Thanks for the info. Still though, there were no Waffen SS in the Luftwaffe. It seems to be a fact that he earned his Ek's flying missions.

What I would like to know is whom did he fly with? What unit was he attached to? Why was he allowed to fly combat missions to begin with since early in his career, he was already too valuble to be used for combat which apparently Hitler or someone also realized? At that time he also had had his dealings with Canaris and the Abwehr and would have been very foolish for someone like him to fly combat missions.

This is a case like what Doolittle did. He was a General commanding air units but insisted on flying combat missions. That was very irrisponsible of him. Had he been shot down and captured would be unthinkable. It would have been an excellent coo for the Germans. Doolittle almost was courtmarshalled for his free-spirited ways.

 

I agree. This is a mystery. That is why I posted this to see if anybody else had any info. I cannot find any details other then he wanted an EK and fly until he got it.

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"They wrote in the old days that it is sweet and fitting to die for one's country. But in modern war there is nothing sweet or fitting in your dying. You will die like a dog for no good reason."

 

This is interesting, i did not know he was a fighter pilot at one time.

 

Sorry to awaken an old thread but I have a Rifle that is and Early Luftwaffe prototype and marked with an SS Skull and Waa63 inspection stamped. Very bizarre and confusing rifle. I believe it was either made and syphoned off to the ss or it was a Luftwaffe division or individual who joined the SS. Very odd that the rifle is inspection stamped Waa63 Luftwaffe marked And with SS Skulls though.

 

There 3 possibilities.

WORST CASE,

A disreputable vendor put the markings to up its value, not unknown.

BETTER CASE,

This is a kit rifle drawing parts from two or more rifles to make one complete, functioning rifle. Also not uncommon.

BEST CASE,

This indeed is a rifle that saw service in the Luftwaffe and the SS. Who got it first is a poser, early Waffen SS had to make do with hand me down equipment so may have gotten there. As noted Luftwaffe service personnel did find themselves organised into ground formations in 43-44 as air strength began to shrink. At this same time Waffen SS formations began to also increase in number as non-Aryans were inducted.

 

The SS produced some 98Ks at Buchenwald. Many of these were probably refurbished arms so some may have come from the LW. Their quality was supposed to be very good because the workers were spared death but also very closely supervised. Thus their collector's value is quite high. Blue Book of Gun Values emphasizes what belasar said: Most 98s found with SS and death's head markings are FAKE!

 

Thanks for the reply, wasn't sure i'd even get one from an old thread. It's wood/metal parts are a 90% original match Very rare to have a Laminated stock from 1937 that is number matched to the metal parts (which this rifle is) Apparently they were exclusive prototypes made specifically for the Luftwaffe (Which it is correctly stamped as with the 'L' Prefix) Laminated stocks were not ''officially released'' until 1938 only a few examples such as this have been recorded and all are Luftwaffe stamped. Only mismatch is the Bolt which appears to be field armoury replaced. The lower band (SS number manufacture waffenamt '623' replacement) and late war unmarked band spring. Was sold on consignment with no back story for very low price as a ''Probably a Russian Capture'' Here in Australia the market isn't very big for K98's Mausers or any rifles really. So we don't need to worry as much about dodgy dealers. Stamps are original and very faded. Rifle smells of heavy use blood and sweat, it's an odd familiar smell. I messed up and put a thick layer of natural oil as I was shooting in the rain etc thinking it was ''just a $500 Russian capture''. What gets me is that the Skull stamps are accompanied by Waffenamt Waa63 inspection stamps which are from what I understand the inspection stamp for Mauser Obendorf. It does have a Stock repair which could've possibly meant it was sent back to the original factory for a thorough repair then re-issued. Check out all 3 vids. It's rather a Bizarre rifle that still shoots great!

 

Yes i'm sure most are, but this doesn't have an ordinary ''Deaths head'' as such... It's more of an elongated symmetrical human skull, I had the rifle for over a year before even noticing it. I messed up covering it in oil before getting decent pics. Never even knew it was Luftwaffe issued. Wasn't until I done a bit of online research and bought a few books that I started to raise my eyebrows as the numbers were nearly fully matching. Upside it still shoots great and the wood and markings are protected. The markings are not just stamped but also burnt or inked on. The Luftwaffe L is inked/burnt on just like the skull. Which the serial on the stock has both of. This rifle has been in Australia since ww2. It took literally weeks to clean the bore I had to shoot it and re clean it, it had purple, green and all sorts come out the bore. It really stinks of blood and sweat. Trying to work out the link between the Luftwaffe and SS when I came across this thread. Glad to see you guys are still active on here. Cheers, Tod.

 

Here's the Link to part 2 of the YT Vid showing the matching wood/metal parts and the extent of pitting. Even the K98 Forum was stumped, but more so appalled at the amount of oil I put on the wood. lol. But it was getting wet in the rain and I wanted to protect it. The mrs never liked it from the smell and the dark colour of it. She said it had a ''Weird vibe'' haha. I love it. And if you watch the vid of shooting a 1935 round through it you'll see just how great it still shoots! It has so many stamps that it stumps even the best of collectors. As it was sold on consignment from a family I got little to no info on it other than ''It shoots ok''. Here in Australia we have to leave the rifle with a Dealer for a month, when I went to pick it up he did have a magnifying glass which I found rather odd. I may go back to speak with him as he's also a serious collector. But since he said nothing when I picked it up I figured he was at a loss also. But perhaps if I disassemble it and get him to have a closer look I may get some answers.

 

Skip t about the 7 min mark in the 1st vid if you want to have a look at the skull under the pistol grip. it won't let me upload pics on here says they're too large.