Like you stated above, knowledge,willingness,lack of sympathy or remorse etc. These are a far cry from doing. Most politico's follow or echo their leaders. You have not mentioned any real crime. Heck, most of our heads of state from the prez on down fit your discription of a criminal.. So, you may just have a point there. They should be in jail till they die also. As far as Barbarossa, Germany almost did the world a big favor. (darn it)
hey man, if you want to see what britain thought about the "peace" offer from nazis, watch this (go to minute 08:05) YouTube - Lost Evidence: " The Battle of Britain " 2 of 5
Hess gambled with his destiny. He wanted to show off and allowed himsel more importance than he really had. He lost his bet and therefore sealed his fate.
Eh, Britain (Churchill) didn't want peace any old way. And if it wern't for the US, they would have lost. America bailed them out again.
Lost? I beg to differ. Maybe not defeated Germany alone, but certainly not lose the war in the sense of being occupied by foreign armies. I don't see that happening, given the course of the war up until 6 Dec 1941, what with Germany elbow-deep in Barbarossa and the Royal Navy holding sway in the North Atlantic and North Seas. I most decidedly would not view our effort in the war as bailing out Great Britain out.
WW1,WW2,Falklands..of course not. I don't think Hitler intended to occupy England to begin with.Didn't need to. (he liked them)
I done a paper once on Hess, he was a strange fellow, here is some of what I found out, Hess has been in recent years to be painted as innocent, and a peace loving patriotic young man who got caught up in this mess, somewhat like Speer, but Hess was anything but innocent in any sense of the word. Here are just a few of the decrees that Hess signed or Bormann his Chief of Staff signed in his stead: September 3rd 1935, Party Agencies ordered to report all persons criticizing Nazi institutions or the Party to the Gestapo. January 7th 1936, Roman Catholics priests hostile to the State or Party to be reported to the Gestapo. March 13th 1938, Law for the reunion of Austria with the German Reich. May 20th 1938, Jews deprived of the right to vote or hold office. July 25th 1938, Jewish doctors are forbidden to treat any but Jewish patients. July 27th 1938, Clergy are forbidden to hold office. September 27th 1938 Jewish Lawyers are suppressed. November 12th 1938, Jews are excluded from economic life. April 30th 1939, Eviction of Jewish tenants by landlords. July 14th 1939, Party members who became clergy or studied theology are expelled. September 1st 1939 and October 8th 1939, Decrees incorporating Poland and Danzig into the Reich. (Bird, Eugene Prisoner Number 7 The Viking Press, New York, New York, 24) The fact is Hess was utterly devoted to Hitler would have done anything for him, and was utterly devoted to Germany, Hess carried out the murder of many of Hitler's opponents, Shirer says this in is book The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich, Hess is seen as a Matyr today by Neo-Nazis, and yes some of the things the United States did to Blacks with the Jim Crowe laws and interning Asians were horrendous, and also using the same methodology to start the Spanish American War as Hitler used to start his was, but the fact is Hess' side lost, he may have been the least innocent (along with Speer) of the snakes, but he still was a snake.
good post Johnny Reb!! and 18mile, on the farm we used to have a saying...... you can pour sugar on a dog turd, that don't make it candy! as stated previously in this thread, he may not have been the worst smelling piece of crap, but he was a piece of crap!
Some interesting information recently release by TNA here in the UK on Hess. It contains minutes of the meetings of the Spandau Prison governors, in addition to correspondence with legal advisers for each of the Four-Power Authorities (UK, USA, France and the Soviet Union). Discussions cover the state of Hess's health and the negotiations between the three western powers and the Soviet governor to allow Hess to receive medical treatment at the British Military Hospital in Berlin. Very interesting information on such an enigmatic character. The National Archives | DocumentsOnline | Image Details Ross
There's no logical reason for the British to murder Hess in the 80s. Hess had been a prisoner in Britain from 1941 to 1945. If he had known any information that could damage Britain, it would have been very easy to arrange his death in custody. In the midst of the war, no one would have paid attention to a mad Nazi killing himself. If it had been arranged at the end of the war, Hess would have been just one of many Nazi leaders taking the easy way out. Instead, Britain transferred Hess to Nuremburg, where he had plenty of opportunity to tell the world whatever he wanted. At Nuremburg, the British judge voted against the death penalty for Hess. For the next 40 years, Hess was held in prison. He was guarded alternately by British, French, American and Soviet guards. Whatever Hess knew, it was something the British government did not mind the French, Russians, or Hess's family finding out. The British also tried several times in the 70s to get Hess released. Yet for some reason, 45 years after the event, what Hess knew suddenly became important enough to kill him for. Despite the fact that almost all the other people involved were long dead. It just doesn't make sense. If the British had any reason to kill Hess, it was in the 40s, when it would have been easier and attracted less attention. About the only people with a motive for killing Hess were some of his guards, who disliked him intensely. They also had opportunity. But arguing that he was murdered by a guard he didn't like isn't quite a grand enough ending for those who idolised Hess.
I think I may have missed something here. I'm not sure what the the whole 'crap' thing is about. BUT..you evidently find some perty strange ways to entertain yer selves on the farm. Hey, people eat chocolate covered ants etc. so I guess your having an alternative to candy should be ok.
what that means is, he is what he is. you can try to sugar coat him any way you like, but in the end he will always be a man who supported hitler. imho, i think he lleft on that plane because he realized that the 3rd reich was doomed! but just my opinion. anyway hope that clears things up.
All clear. We are all entitled to our opinions. I don't think at that time losing really crossed his mind. I also don't think any head of state can be sugar coated. And I still say he got screwed.
Slipdigit: I've been told by a certain individual in the back channels that I haven't followed proper internet protocol because I didn't respond with correct line of reasoning. Soooo, I will try to correct my stance. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~Patton wuz cool.~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ How's that? Please note, my tongue is FIRMLY in my cheek. Oh yeah, B.L.M. was a weanie.
My father spoke fluent German; in the British Army, he was Guard Commander on a number of occasions at Spandau between 1964-66. He reported: 1. Many enlightening conversations with Albert Speer, whom he found to be a very interesting personality. 2. Baldur von Schirach was a grumpy old man who spoke to nobody if he could help it. 3. Rudolf Hess was impossible to communicate with. He held shouted conversations with himself, flushed his toilet constantly, summoned the guards to his cell then angrily dismissed them ("What are you doing here? Get out of my room!") The list goes on. And no - I don't think the British silenced him 20 years ago. They could've done that at any time between 1941-45. Klive.
This is very interesting to read Klive. Thank you for sharing this. I would have expected Speer to be a clever man. Speer precisely used this honorabilty aspect to try to convince the Judges that he was a "nice guy". He knew how to dress well , talk well but when you took off the mask you found the dreadful war criminal who used slave labour.
An Internet acquaintance who's father also guarded Hess told of how he sometimes liked to Hoover the grass at the prison...
