Free French forces + resistance

well this is a bit more like two questions. What was the influence of the french army during the later period of ww2 within france. Second question is what was the uniform like because i have been told it became similar to the british battledress is this true.

thankyou in advance for any advice/ answers

 

I'm not so sure about this, but i bet Skipper knows The Norwegian army wasn't effected that much by the resistance, the army in exile took over when they came back. But also used a lot of captured German weapons and equipment, at first they dumped most of the equipment, but then they figured out that they needed it.

 

After their crushing defeat by Hitler's armies in 1940, the French military was esentially a shell. Even before the war the French had few or no General officers with the tactical skill, adroitness and abilities of Manstein, Rommel, Kesselring, and the rest of the extremely capable German high command. During and after the war this was even less so.

individual French soldiers were often quite good, of course, and many fought on in other allied armies after Dunkerque. many french pilots flew in the Battle of Britain, for example. But after that the French armies played a largely irrelevant role in world war 2. When Degaulle's armored column was the first allied unit to return to Paris in 1944, it was frankly nothing more than a complete window-dressing - because the French re-entry only came after the anglo-American victory at D-day and the subsequent breakout that made it all possible.
French military affairs and politics were so messed up that Free French and Vichy French wound up fighting each other on more than one occasion (imagine American forces doing that.)

By the end of the war in May 1945, France had 1,250,000 troops, 10 divisions of which were fighting in Germany.By the end of the war in May 1945, France had 1,250,000 troops, 10 divisions of which were fighting in Germany. This was a formidable force and certainly helped the allied advance through Germany, but for 4 years the anglo-americans, and the soviets, had done the bulk of the fighting, and dying, with very little French help.

the French, due to bad circumstances, probably ultimately helped the German side far more then the allies. The german army rolled on french trucks, when available, and French farmers (along with the Danish) fed much of the Wehrmacht. There were even many French volunteers for the Waffen SS.
The answer to the question seems to be, the French did as much as they could, while spening 4 years trapped under the German thumb - but usually only as supporting, secondary, or reserve units.

 

While the import of the Free French forces have been discussed on this thread, this link may help you figure out the "uniforms" used by the various French forces in the time period. They were really supplied by two other allied quartermasters, the US/UK as well as having some of their own supply. And BTW, it was LeClerc's armored column which first entered and secured Paris. DeGaulle followed a day or two later.

See:

Uniformes français de la FTL / FFO French uniforms

 

I would never dismiss the French role in the British defence of North Africa. They showed the way when we were in retreat by holding the line in one famous instance. I wont keep referring to it..I have had to on every occasion the French have been maligned. Suffice to say they held the line and stopped the rot.

 

Unconventionally the sabotage and intelligence work of the Resistance saved many lives during the Battle of Normandy and beyond. The Third Army for example was able to advance insouciantly with no regard to its flanks partly because the Resistance kept Patton appraised of German dispositions. However, the war could go on without them.

Conventionally Free French forces contributed about a Corps to the war in Europe, some of their divisions performed quite well. Due to the amalgamation of professional colonial troops and resistance fighters of different ideological stripes in their divisions, Free French units were often not as disciplined or efficient as allied forces. Never the less, the Free French provided the manpower to shield the extreme right flank of the Allied Armies and participated in brutal actions during Operation Nordwind.

When all is said and done, they were men--and women--who answered the call of duty and deserve the same respect given to other nationalities.

 

Yet the resistance would have not been able to do much without the help from the SAS and Jedburgh teams ; that provided training, arms and more than anything coordination (within themselves as well as coordination with the allies).

 

Do you really think the SOE was behind any Resistant? The SOE did a great job, but they had little Bilingual agents that could operate on occupied soil. Help and supplies were greatly appreciated but, SOE parachutings were strictly reserved for a few key maquis and the large majority of Maquisards got their weapons and training themselves (by taking them from Germans for instance) . There are even examples of Maquis that started an uprising without enough weapons and still hoping they would get supplies, but never did and got massacred , such as the Vercors Maquis by the Ost Legionen and by FallshimrJäger parachuted behind thier lines in July 1944. Maquis du Vercors - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Not the SOE, but the Abwehr and the SD ... Of course we shouldn't generalize, but the different resistance movements were usually plagued by ennemy agents.

As of the SOE / OSS, of course they didn't mandate every action of the war regarding the resistance. But near the end after Overlord, they played a big part in organizing the lot to act as pathfinders, security for overun cities, bridges, and other railroads etc..
As of the 'few' key maquis, they represent quite a big lot of people. (once again I am not generalizing neither am saying resistance did nothing by themselves) .

 

You have a point here Trud3r, but what I know from interviewing Resistants is that they mostly didn't even know what organisation they belonged too. I remembered this lady which sheltered U.S. airmen who did not know those who "dropped" the airmen before her farm, nor who her own leader was. She just had instructions to shelter them and take them to a different place after so many days. The rule swere "the les syou know, the less you"ll tell". Many did not choose to become Resistants , but became involved by fate, because someone knocked at their door and asked for help. Others were searched for by Germans and/or were trying to evade forced labor and/or deportation.
What I'm trying to say is that many individuals were alone for months/years, before a stuctured network started to be monitorized via the SOE, the Free French in London and much later (in 1943) by large structurized regional groups in France, for instance the one led by Jean Moulin until his arrest and death.

Jean Moulin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

i think the french armd div in normandy should never have been allowed to land.they did not follow orders when they sent a column to paris,leaving the u.s corps it was assigned to one div down.
i think ike was going to leave paris alone,for supply purposes,but was forced to feed etc,the parisians.cheers.

 

France supposedly had better tanks than the Germans, and good planes and artillery. Her Navy was second only the British, and she was building, slowly, new battleships. Middle rank leaders like Charles DeGaulle showed new techniques. But the leadership was slow to adopt them.

The Gestapo drove Former French soldiers, communists, and socialists, as well as disillusioned Vichy officials, into remote areas of France to hide, where they organized. By 1942 eight major resistance groups based on political affiliation and geography were active, rescuing Allied pilots, striking German transportation, and distributing illegal propaganda. At DeGaulle's urging, Jean Moulin was dropped into France by the Special Operation Executive (SOE) and he unified the resistance into a single command. While the resistance has become romanticized, they were never more than partisians, and were unable to fight the Germans in the two pitched battles known to take place.

France in World War II - World War II Multimedia Database

 

After the war General Dwight D. Eisenhower wrote:
"Throughout France the Resistance had been of inestimable value in the campaign. Without their great assistance the liberation of France would have consumed a much longer time and meant greater losses to ourselves."

And why did the resistance got help from SOE, OSS, SAS, Jedburgh and co :

 

THat's not supposedly, for instance here is the losses for air battles during the invasion in 1940 , you can see for yourself that the greatest losses are not were you 'expect' them...


But then when the tacticians are not 'smart' well , you end up with the German army marching in Paris.
And for the tanks :


you see that the B1 is quite decent compared to the German tanks of 1940.. or later eg only the Panzer IV will reach the same size.

 

I stated supposedly so I don't have to state Proof or link that supported my Claim.

Actually the Tanks the Frances had, were much better tanks. Plus the two links I provided.

 

Back to the topic guys, this is not about comparing tanks and cliché jokes .