Devastating Battles

The war had seen many devastating battles AND offensives. Three of the most were Kursk, Midway and Ardennes.

Kursk was one of the three most devastating because of its sheer size and the possible outcomes. Two German armies faced off against nine Soviet armies in the most epic clash of man and machine ever in history. The Russians had laid thousands of anti-tank and anti-personnel mines per mile of front. They had a half dozen concentric defensive positions, and were kept minutely aware of the Germans' plans by the secret spy ring in Switzerland.
The Germans attacked on July 5th, advancing in the north six miles on a twelve mile front, losing 25,000 men and 200 tanks in the first day. In the south, things were going slightly better. The Germans punched a twelve mile dent in the Russian lines on a nine mile front, losing only 10,000 men but having 300 tanks destroyed in the process. They lost 203 aircraft in this first day as well. All this was besides unknown Russian dead.
On the second day, the Germans lost more men, an unknown amount, but certainly lower than that of the first day, alongside 300 tanks and 111 aircraft.
All in all, the Kursk offensive was one of the deadliest single offensives. It cost the two sides the lion's share of the men, tanks and planes tossed into the skirmish. The German 4th Armored and 9th Armies were nearly destroyed, but the Central and Bryansk Fronts were able to crush the German forces that had made those small penetrations.

Midway took place from June 4th, 1942, to June 7th. It involved an American task force and a Japanese invasion force. The Japanese were trying to invade Midway when the American Supreme Command was alerted by spies of the Japanese force leaving for Midway. The Americans threw their own force into the Pacific for this massive battle.
The two sides clashed four hundred miles north of Midway, when American aircraft spotted one of the Japanese carriers. By the end of the battle, four Japanese carriers had been sunk, and the Japanese sunk one American carrier.

The Ardennes Offensive was the final German offensive of the war. It involved two or three armies, and took place over a relatively small and quiet portion of the Allied Western Front. Just over a month before the fall of Aachen, Hitler presented a plan to his supreme commanders to defeat the Allied armies. The offensive was aimed at Bastogne and Antwerp, the latter of which was far out of the Wehrmacht's reach. The Germans attacked on December 16th, catching the Americans and British off guard. They did not expect the Wehrmacht, whom they thought was thoroughly crushed, to be able to launch such a large-scale offensive. But less than three weeks later, the German thrust had stopped just after besieging Bastogne because of stiff American resistance both inside the town and a few miles north, west and south of it. The Americans began forcing back the Germans on New Year's Day, and by January 26th the German forces were all the way back at their starting lines. They had lost 80,000 men, a blow irreversible and doomed to speed up the conclusion of the European War. The Americans and British lost 100,000 men, a gap that could be made good within three weeks.

If there are more devastating battles, I would like to hear feedback.

 

oh weeeeee there were plenty in the air at land and at sea

if you post midway for naval battles you should also think about leyte gulf the biggest sea battle ever or the philipine sea okinawa iwo jima guadalcanal bob battle of germany (air) stalingrad charkov crim monte cassino el al amein hürtgen forrest battle of berlin seelower heights normandy crete saipan singapore etc sorry for posting no details but that will blow the frame

 

Some errors here...

The Ardennes offensive was not the final German offensive of the war. There was Operation Nordwind, in the Alsace, which started on New Year's Eve, 1945, and the counterattack at Lake Balaton in February 1945 I believe.

This offensive was started over a 65-kilometer stretch of front, which is hardly small for a first wave of only 8-10 divisions.

The plan was first presented to Hitler's highest commanders in September, before the fall of Aachen. They were to fill in the details for Hitler to unveil to the actual field commanders that would be involved, later on (which happened on December 12th).

The Offensive was not aimed at Bastogne. This road net was only a minor goal for the minor thrust of this offensive, which was aimed at Brussels. For the last time, the aims of the armies participating in the offensive were as follows:
15th Army: holding a line running Monschau - Eupen - Liege.
6th Panzer Army: crossing the Meuse at Huy to capture Antwerp.
5th Panzer Army: crossing the Meuse at Namur to capture Brussels.
7th Army: holding a line running Luxembourg - Libramont - Givet.
Note that there were four armies participating in this offensive, not two or three.

No British unit held any part of the line attacked by the Germans on December 16th.

The most important defences the Americans held during this offensive were those at Elsenborn Ridge (99th and 2nd Infantry), La Gleize/Stoumont (30th Infantry, 82nd AB and 3rd Armoured), St Vith (106th Infantry and 7th Armoured), and the river Salm (82nd AB). All of these disrupted German plans for the main thrust of the offensive - the Northern thrust by 6th Panzer Army. In the south defences were equally tenacious but much less decisive. Only after the offensive had failed (which it officially did on December 24th, 8 days after it begun, even Hitler acknowledged) did the Germans increase pressure on Bastogne because they needed the road network for their succesful withdrawal. It is also often assumed that Hitler wished to take revenge on the Americans for making his offensive fail by making the death toll around Bastogne as high as possible, but that is of course just conjecture.

The Germans lost approximately 120,000 men in this offensive, roughly 45,000 dead. The Americans and British together lost something near 80,000 men, of which 35,000 were dead.

 

got my facts mixed up on that last one ... oops. I was clos on the numbers, though!

 

Yeah, Roel is the fount of all knowledge on the Ardennes...

Wow - the Germans launched an offensive 6 months after the war ended!

 

The US were not alerted by Spies, it was the CINCPAC Codebreakers that were able to decifer the Japanese naval communications and determine not only that an attack was to take place, but also through a fairly simple ruse the location of the objective (They instructed Midway to radio that their desalination plant had broken, when the Japanese then radioed that the objective would be short of water they knew with reasonable certainty where it was).

The initial clashes took place over Midway itself, 36 Vals, 36 Kates and 36 Zeroes attacked the garisson but missed most of the land based aircraft (Except the Marine's Bufallo and Wildcat fighters) which had already departed.

The Japanese were then attacked at irregular intervals by torpedo and level and glide bombing attacks, which had no effect, until the Navy SBD Dauntlesses arrived overhead. With the entire Japanese fighter cover down at wave top height the Navy Divebombers were able to attack unmolested causing fatal damage to the Akagi, Kaga and Soryu all in the space of 5 minutes. Hiryu was to survive until another couple of days.

The Japanese were able to mount a counter strike with the returning aircraft from the Midway strike and those that were able to rearm and refuel aboard the Hiryu. This group attacked the USS Yorktown (Which was separate from and actually a separate task force from the USS Enterprise and USS Hornet as Yorktown sailed slightly later owing to damage recieved at Coral Sea), causing heavy but not fatal damage. Yorktown was abandoned only to be reboarded and was on her way back to Hawaii when a Japanese submarine torpedoes her and the Destroyer USS Hamman (SP?) which was moored alongside.

The US also located part of a Cruiser group detailed to bombard Midway, attacking and sinking the Mikuma and inflicting heavy damage on the Mogami.

Total US losses were the Fleet Carrier Yorktown, Destroyer Hamman and around 100 aircraft.

Total Japanese losses were the Fleet Carriers Akagi and Kaga, the Light Carriers Soryu and Hiryu, the Cruiser Mikuma and the entire air group around 300 aircraft.

As has been already stated though, in terms of numbers involved and losses inflicted there were much greater and much more devastating battles in the Pacific (Leyte Gulf, Guadalcanal, the Phillipine Sea), however in terms of the damage inflicted on the Japanese Carriers in such a short space of time (Akagi, Kaga and Soryu all suffered fatal damage in only 5 minutes) I don't think the others compare.

 

I knew 'bout CINCPAC, but I thought that Richard Sorge guy also told them, or was he just working for the commies (Soviets, i mean (i hate communism, it doesn't work)).

:bang: :smok: :kill: :bang: :smok: :kill:

The lack of Japanese involvement on the Eastern Front in 1941 also helped change the course of the war. The Soviets were sending 90% of their armies to face the Germans, so a Japanese invasion might have been completely successful instead of chancing not bombing the all-important aircraft carriers.

:bang: :smok: :kill: :bang: :smok: :kill:

 

AFAIK Sorge worked only for the Soviets, the groundwork and intelligence used to defeat Nagumo at Midway was entirely the work of CINCPAC and it is to them alone the credits belong.

 

I'm sorry, language barrier. In Dutch, "new year" and "new year's eve" is January 1st, and the evening before it (December 31st) is called "old year's eve". Makes much more sense, too.

 

well i've heard before we all make mistakes

 

Not at all - 'eve' means the evening before the event...

 

Who was Commander in Chief in the Pacific? Nimitz?

 

Do you even know what communism is???

 

Yes, and somehow whenever it is applied it manages to either mutate into a very repressive regime and/or a semi-Capitalist state...

 

Communism is a classless society in which all nathions have been desolved.

 

I know the theory - where has it worked, and remained 'pure' communism?

 

There hasnt been pure communism, how could there when nathions still exist?
However cuba has bacame a decent country sice the revouluthion.

 

Sovietsniper, Pure Communism is a noble ideal, however it cannot in the foreseeable future be applied to any human government because of the imperfections of the human race. As Ricky has noted pretty much wherever Communism has been established, it has been usurped or twisted by those whose natural skills favour doing so and become a dictatorship.

I have heard it said that Cuba is repressive also (And there can be little arguing against Castro being a dictator in Cuba), perhaps not so much as China or Stalin's Soviet Union, but whilst espousing the (Arguable) ideal of Communism it is also worth acknowldging the impracticality of the ideal and that human failings will almost always derail it.

I have to ask and I apologise if this seems insulting, how old are you? I ask because you have a firmness in your convictions that I at least recognise now in myself when I was much younger, now I am older and more cynical my views from then seem almost naive. Just to reiterate, there is nothing wrong with striving for an ideal, but you have to acknowledge when that ideal will be ultimately flawed because the fundamental ingredients (Human beings) are also flawed.

 

Yes, Nimitz was the Commander in Chief, "Bull" Halsey was the carrier commander, but he was hospitalised during Midway (WIth Shingles I believe, although I could be incorrect) and made an inspired choice in Spruance to command the Task Forces at Midway.

Spruance was an unusual choice as he was a Cruiser man by trade and had no prior experience commanding carriers, but he certainly proved the right man for the job and his handling of Midway was, for want of a better word, perfect.

 

It's wonderful..that's why people swim on rafts to escape the hell of decadent ,Capitalist Miami in order join the glorious Communist paradise on Cuba...oh wait...my bad...nevermind