Deserters and defectors in WWII

I understand the German forces saw a number of deserters and defectors, especially towards the end of the war. I´ve also read about a Soviet pilot who defected to Japan during the war, taking his LaGG-3 with him.

Does anybody have any stats or any good stories on the subject ?

 

how about Rudolph Hess?

 

Yes, I forgot about him. That guy is worthy of a topic on his own.

Nice to see you back, me262.

 

I believe desertion was as common in WW2 as it was in most wars, but possibly higher among the Russian infantry as soon as they realized they were being used as cannon fodder, and the American infantry as soon as they realized they were infantry because they weren't good enough for any other function (this is how the US army usually worked).

Defection, not so much except after capture. There are of course the thousands of Russians from POW camps who defected to the Germans in the early war years.

 

there was a unit of cossaks that after their surrendering to the herr volunteered to serve as a escort to some prisioners send to germany, the germans officers taught they will escape but what was their surpirse that they returned to get orders,(problem is that i do not remember what units are invloved of the officers) and as many russians defectors , were captured and executed by the russians as traitors

 

Roel you've reallygot to get off this kick. The US Army realized the problem and by early 1944 had discontinued many of the programs that sucked off the more capable men from the infantry. This (low quality of US infantry) is closer to myth than fact.

 

Oh, well thanks for clearing that up then. I guess the usual knowledge about the US army comes from the initial situation and overlooks the improvements made later, as seen when the Sherman is discussed...

 

"Yes, I forgot about him. That guy (Hess) is worthy of a topic on his own."

As is Vlasov.

 

Slovak army on the eastern front was the only Axis army of a Slavonic nation, so it took only a short time till Slovak soldiers started to desert. The most of them, more than one battalion ran over to the Red army at Melitopol in September 1943. This was also the end of Slovak infantry on the eastern front. At the same time three Slovak fighter pilots flew to the other side with their Bf-109 G-4's equipped with the newest radio. Soviets appreciated all such actions and most of the Slovak soldiers and airmen were later incorporated to the 1st Czechoslovak army corps in USSR. This corps therefore consisted mostly of Slovaks, which makes a result thet in the resistance during the war fought more Slovaks then Czechs, though the number of population was different...

 

I think you're right. But the US Army did need to get a bloody nose in North Africa before realizing that not everyone could serve in the Air Force or go to college for the duration. It took the massive losses in Normandy to show that the individual repalcement system merely allowed units to remain in the line too long and turn good units in sleep-walkers.

 

As brutal as Stalin was, his policy of execution on site really helped to cut down the ranks of deserters.

 

Well, there was also mine-clearance duty...
Squads of caught deserters would be marched over a known minefield.
Any survivors would be pardoned.

The French in 1939/40 used sheep for this, I believe.

 

I believe General Montgomery once commented he would have lost less men at El Alamain if he'd been able to clear minefields that way.

 

The Russians used their "punishment batallions" for all kinds of duties that would probably get all those involved killed in an instant. Minefield clearing, assaulting well-defended positions first... Anything. It probably worked, but the cruelty! I heard that Zhukov was especially fond of using such methods.

 

Interesting...
Zhukov usually was relatively sparing with his men's lives. Compared to other Soviet Commanders.
Maybe punishment battalions do not count?

 

Makes you want to volunteer in the Red Army ha??

 

what about the Imperial japan army...wonder how many defected even though they are downright loyal.

 

but remember that the japs prefered to die rather than surrender, for them surrender is shamefull to do that, so i do not thing there are many deserters

 

I dont think there were any Japanese deserters. Heck even Japanese prisoners were scarce.

 

yeap, I totaly agree with you on this one