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Always Blaming it on the US?

Discussion in 'Military History' started by Spaniard, Apr 26, 2010.

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  1. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    OpanaPointer, Apr 29, 2010
    #21
  2. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    Spaniard, Apr 29, 2010
    #22
  3. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    No serious invasion by either side.
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 29, 2010
    #23
  4. formerjughead

    formerjughead The Cooler King

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    Posturing and sabre rattling
     
    formerjughead, Apr 30, 2010
    #24
  5. A-58

    A-58 Cool Dude

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    It would make a good movie....
     
    A-58, Apr 30, 2010
    #25
  6. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    Face-saving moves for the "folks back home".

    I'm surprised nobody has mentioned "Plan Red" yet.
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #26
  7. A-58

    A-58 Cool Dude

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    Was it in place in 1862?
     
    A-58, Apr 30, 2010
    #27
  8. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    No, it was created in response to the situation in Europe in 1940. The proposed plan would move troops into Canada to bolster local forces in case England fell and the Axis was putting pressure on Canada to make concessions of territory.

    It is, however, yet another "invade Canada" scenario. :cool:
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #28
  9. A-58

    A-58 Cool Dude

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    Yes, it does make for a good read and discussion piece. All of the Rainbow plans do for that matter.
     
    A-58, Apr 30, 2010
    #29
  10. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    I'm good with Rainbow-5 and Dog One, less excited about talking about ones that were never implemented, like Orange.
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #30
  11. A-58

    A-58 Cool Dude

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    I'm not familiar with Dog-1, but have read some on the color coded war plans in the past. The concentration of my readings have been on War Plan Orange, and in particular, Mac's poor performance in the Philippines.
     
    A-58, Apr 30, 2010
    #31
  12. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    Plan Dog was the USN oriented version of Rainbow-5. "Only the good bits" according to one officer.

    Orange is interesting as a prequel to Rainbow plans. The problem arises when people start talking "Orange" and referring to "Rainbow-5" and vice versa. If we're not on the same page "merry chaos ensues."

    Dougie Mac I have largely avoided, except when necessary. New Guinea should have been isolated and the Japanese there starved of fuel and ammo. (And I am ready for the repost on that, as always.)
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #32
  13. A-58

    A-58 Cool Dude

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    Yes Mac's military genius leaves a lot to be desired. The more I read about him the more there is to detest. Too many places in the Pacific could have been neutralized and by-passed for that matter.
     
    A-58, Apr 30, 2010
    #33
  14. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    Dougie was good for keeping the SWPA in the public attention. He was tough on his soldiers in the process. "American Caesar" indeed. And that's not a compliment.
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #34
  15. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    A 1935 US Plan for Invasion of Canada

    Submitted by F.W. Rudmin
    Queen's University
    Kingston, Ontario Canada

    Email: rudminf@qucdn.queensu.ca
    FAX: (613) 545-6611

    The following is a full-text reproduction of the 1935
    plan for a US invasion of Canada prepared at the US Army
    War College, G-2 intelligence division, and submitted on
    December 18, 1935. This is the most recent declassified
    invasion plan available from the US archival sources.
    Centered pagination is that of the original document. The
    spelling and punctuation of the original document are
    reproduced as in the original document, even when in error
    by present-day norms.

    GLASNOST Berlin - A 1935 US Plan for Invasion of Canada


    Did the U.S. plan an invasion of Canada in the 1920s?

    The Straight Dope: Did the U.S. plan an invasion of Canada in the 1920s?
     
    Spaniard, Apr 30, 2010
    #35
  16. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #36
  17. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    Plan Dog Original document from 1940

    Plan Dog, 26 pages


    War Plan Orange
    War Plan Orange - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


    Rainbow 5 was the battle plan developed by the military in case war broke out. Publishing the plan or leaking information about the plan would be the equivalent of publishing or leaking the battle order of the Pentagon during the Cold War. Unquestionably, leaking such a plan was an act of treason. In Hitler's speech declaring war against the United States on December 11, 1945, the final straw he listed was as follows.
    "With no attempt at an official denial there has now been revealed in America, President Roosevelt's plan by which, at the latest in 1943, Germany and Italy are to be attacked in Europe by Military means."43

    The War Years: Rainbow 5 and the Great Sit Down Strike



    I Just posted the links so others can understand what both are discussing.
    ​
     
    Spaniard, Apr 30, 2010
    #37
  18. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    See, Wiki doesn't link to the text of Rainbow-5. That's just sloppy.

    Pre-War Allied Planning

    Joint Committee Exhibit No. 49, United States-British Staff Conversations (ABC-1 talks on division of military responsibility in case of US entry into the war.)
    Joint Committee Exhibit No. 50, American-Dutch-British Conversations, discussing military cooperation in the Far East, April, 1941.
    Joint Committee Exhibit No. 51, Joint Canadian-United States Basic Defense Plan No. 2 (Short Title-ABC-22), discussing military cooperation between Canada and the United States.
    Navy Basic War Plan-Rainbow No. 5 (WPL-46)
    Navy Plan O-1
    The "short version" of Rainbow-5, with only those sections specific to the Pacific Fleet.
    (Hart Exhibit #16.)
    Joint Committee Exhibit No. 55, CONFERENCE IN THE OFFICE OF THE CHIEF OF STAFF AT 10:00 A. M., TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 25, 1941 (Concerning, among other things, allocation of B-17s.)
    Memo from Gen. Marshall and Adm. Stark to FDR on the situation in the Far East
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #38
  19. Spaniard

    Spaniard New Member

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    It was my pleasure, While I was searching I saw Your Link concerning Rainbow-5, RAINBOW-5 will have to take a closer look since I just browsed, quite interesting documentation from 41. I Figured those old papers would be of interest to you Mr Pointer ;)
     
    Spaniard, Apr 30, 2010
    #39
  20. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member Patron   WW2|ORG Editor

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    Always looking for solid documentation. I once had a copy of the Hawaiian Territory SOP manual for 1940. It was signed in ink:

    Good luck, Jimmy!
    H.E. Kimmel.
     
    OpanaPointer, Apr 30, 2010
    #40
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