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British and other armies not getting enough respect?

Discussion in 'Military History' started by redfan45, Dec 30, 2008.

  1. redfan45

    redfan45 Member

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    Didint know where else to put this...

    I've read alot and believe myself that the British and the other countries in this war arent getting the respect they deserve. I've talked to several people who thought that the US was the only country fighting, but no as iam sure you all know there are others. And even in their own countries they dont get good respect, as a article i read stated "
    In the United States, he said, troops were frequently feted with homecoming parades, free tickets to sports games and discounts on goods in shops and restaurants. In Britain, such outpourings of support are rare."
    So maybe they arent getting enough respect.
    So next time you support your troops think about them aswell cause without them America like WW1 WW2 would have probaly lost!
    By the way, its my plan to move to England and join the army there and fight for my ancestors land, 4 more years to go...
    Heres the full article if you yanks(I know iam american too) dont mind reading it. British troops deserve more respect: top general - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)
    enjoy
     
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  2. JCFalkenbergIII

    JCFalkenbergIII Expert

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    Just wanted to point out that BOTH WWI and WWII were going on years before the US got involved. Great Britain and others were involved before the US ever entered either.If not for that the US would not have been at involved in either war. It was the US entry in each war that helped doom the enemy. The only possible way that the US could have "lost" the war would be if ALL the other ALLIES were defeated. I give credit where credit is do. I don't hold one country over another. It was a group and ALLIED effort. Each doing its part to defeat the Axis as best they could.
     
  3. Skipper

    Skipper Kommodore

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    Agreed. The fact that one can lack respect for an army shows precisely they deserve respect all the more because if we can talk about respect when regarding them, is precisely because they are there to protect our democracies that allows us frre speech. I am not talking about dictatorships and corrupt counties of course.
     
  4. Joe

    Joe Ace

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    I congratulate you on what you are trying to say, but I suggest you read up on the subject.
    There was and still is homecoming parades (However the Victory parade in 1945 left out the Poles, so not to anger the Russians. Disgusting if you ask me!), in fact Children who where brought up during the war where terrified of all the partying, with the blackout and all that.

    But what else you say ins entirely correct. A while ago I "talked" to a person who said that Britain would have lost WW1, WW2 and the Falklands war without U.S. help.
    Ha!
    The U.S. entered WW1 when the Germans where already beaten, Hitler indefinitely postponed Operation Sealion (So Britain was safe), and the Falklands! There was only one aircraft downed with a U.S. supplied Stinger missile! The U.S. did more to condemn the British effort in the Falklands!

    Anyway, pardon my outburst!
     
  5. Piat

    Piat Member

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    I think history will judge us on how much respect/achknowledgement we recieve, which sadly will probably not be enough. Especially when you turn on the television to what seems like every week to hear about another man/woman in our forces KIA.

    Britain is doomed though, we have practically no real pride left in my opinion. And all the things that make us British get stripped away more each and everyday.
     
  6. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    I suspect that the armed forces of Great Britain are going through what the US did during the Vietnam War. An unpopular war and the soldiers took the wrath of the public.

    In the US, the public vowed not to repeat what happened to the US soldiers after their return from Vietnam. So Those returning from the Desert Sheild/Storm operations, were given a hero's welcome and have since then.

    It only takes one to get something started. I have seen and read news reports from Great Britain of what the soldiers there who have returned are having difficulty in adjusting primarily because they feel nothing was achieved and that their achievements are not being recognized. Much the same as what our Vietnam vets experienced. So, perhaps someone can form up a group and go to the airports where these soldiers are flying into and provide a hearty welcome. Send announcements to the press and ask for coverage to get the word out.

    Much like how it got started here. Upon my return from Desert Shield/Storm, our first stop into the US was at Bangor, ME and I swear the whole population was out there. While the Plane was refueling, the town chatted with us, served us Hamburgers, Hotdogs, drinks. It was an awesome feeling. This was in 91'.

    I hope the British public do come around and regardless of how they feel about their government's foreign policies, they show respect to the men and women who have and are serving.
     
  7. Piat

    Piat Member

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    Yeah I mean it's not all bad some parades do happen and generally have a good turn out, it's just they could be better. A few months back there was a parade in Northern Ireland that had a great turn out, which a decade or two ago would never have been possible in N.I.

    I think people just don't get why we are there or still there. In living memory we have nearly always went to war to protect our territory, WWII, the Falklands etc... but now were in the middle east fighting the war on Terror.
     
  8. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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    I suppose it depends on where you come from.

    I wouldnt expect America to go overboard about British troops in action at present time, they are British not American. We are allies with a particular respect gained thru many years of common adversity and sharing of same dangers. We share same desks at many Hq's today. So the individual soldier from each nation is more likely to be aware of the others presence and losses etc and will act accordingly. Our mass publics are different for obvious reasons. I dont blame America for not knowing too much about our effort if that is indeed the case. A large nation dealing with its own large armed forces and its own casualites and vets. But I think most know of who their allies are.

    As for British support for returning vets...yes it started off in a disgusting fashion. It has changed now.

    Officialdom and petty rules still abound with the govt and charities etc, but the public as a whole, support and respect what our guys and gals are doing. The cause is not always supported, the cry of bring em home is oft heard, but the forces themselves have found a new awakened respect.

    Stories in the media will always be of the treated badly etc, small minded folk will always exist, but this is no longer the case as a whole thru the UK.

    Even the Irish in northern Ireland turned out in numbers unheared of for a welcome home of returning troops...through Belfast...something unheard of for decades..Yes some anti's for obvious reasons, but the welcom they received, marching thru the city was unheared of after the troubles.

    Wooton Basset turns out for every funeral cortege that passes thru its town the nearest to Brize Norton where dead are flown back to. The cars will slow to walking pace led by a funeral walker, and the whole town will stand in the streets to pay their respeces as the bodies go thru.

    Most major towns including my own now have regualr homecoming parades and the trooops are cheered. I dont hear any jeers. I never have. That doesnt mean everyone agrees with missions.

    The latest funeral of which I myself attended was well attended by locals and vets.

    Sporting clubs amongst others, offer free tickets, discounts are given in some clubs and pubs, resteraunts, not enough, but a welcome from early beginnings.

    The Public in the UK, have for many years not seen their own forces, unless you were a vet, or had interest in miltary affairs they have been invisible, getting on with their job but not in our faces. That goes with the inevitable draw down of forces in large numbers.

    The days when even I would hitchhike in uniform, or see many of us no so long back with kit bags in full uniform at railway stations are gone now.

    Officialdom does I think have a large part to play. Over zelous commanding officers telling them not to wear uniform in public. Change at airports, dont do this do that, stems from the officials not from the public at large.

    There seems to be a certain pc that has attached from civilian life to service life, and it lives it seems in the higher echelons not the lower ones.

    I have my gripes of course, with the remedial stuff....Headly court should not have to go cap in hand to public for a swimming pool rather than use the Leatherhead one which I used over 20 years ago with injured and wounded. Why does the govt and MOD not have this sorted out by now... It should have long been provided by now. They have the smaller health pool but after all these years why only now is one being considered and by charitable means not Govt?

    The vets old and new alike are treated terribley as always by officialdom when it comes ot benefits claiming. No seperate vets agency exists like in states, although we are told one does...it does in name only, and offers advice thru the normal benefit agencies..where you end up anyway. and are treated no differently from the scorungers and wasters who sometimes live off the things. Thats not to deny others on benefits, but no ex vet disabled or otherwise shoud have to grovel for the basics of life be it medical or moneteirst at a time of need. Ive been there, its not easy and your sometimes treated as a pain for pointing out you are supposed to have better access.

    Gordon talks of mighty all service folk and relatives now have access to priority treatment in health service, its just words. The priority is still based on clinical need and left to individual doctors and surgeons, its still their choice and in most part they neither understand the advice or want to comply.

    The service charities are on the whole good, but even there they are sometimes overwhelmed with the numbers now coming forwards.

    The public as a whole treat forces here with respect, the govt and its offices though are and always have been a different matter.
     
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  9. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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    I shouldnt be too harsh on the Americans over the Falklands Joe.

    Yes it was our unbelievably determined and brave guys that did the job. No one better at the time. Probably in my jaundiced view he best British forces ever at the time. Apart from those I now see in present operations...kudos to them too.

    But as in Maggies own Downing st. Years, she did get a trifle impatiant with Ronny...telling Al to not be so wet and telling Ronny to get off the fence, but it was not the end of the world to relationships.

    The Americans were aghast that this could happen maybe, between two of their allies, but it was never in any doubt who when the chips fell they would support and indeed did so. It was galling of us at the time to see it taking the time it did though I will confess.

    As for help, the release from Nato stocks of the Sidewinder L, although not American supplied to indivdual units, had to have permission from America as this was for European use against the threat residing there at the time. They could have vetod this request, and we would have been left with the older version, things then may have been much different for the Harriers.

    The offer of a carrier as we know, was a little off the mark, although they did offer one if we lost one of our own, how this would have been manned and worked up, stored, etc, the timescale etc, made it to us an empty offer, but it in itself was a show of support.

    The island of St.Helena was indeed one of British protectorates, but the airfield and tower etc operated by Americans, yes we had access, but we didnt have the right to support by the American staff already there and offered gladly and freely. Without which things could have been logistically timeconsuming.

    The number of American tankers queuing up at the island at one stage when support in Washington had not even come of the so called fence yet was there for all to see, although played down at the time. Another help by them we could not have easily done without.

    At the end of the day, they did support us, they took no part in any fighting I know, this was a plainly obvious British action, but American logistics, even if not on the massive scale of an attack by Soviets thru Europe, was plainly there to see.

    Again, the New Zealand govt stepped up to the mark...relieving our forces in Gulf so we could release and extra ship. Originally the offer was to sail with our task force but politically we found a better use for their offer.

    Even the French, stepped in. Yeovaltan became full of French accents at one time, the dog fights between French Mirages and sea harriers are well documented and should not be missed out within the area of support from other nations at the time. Details of the Exocet numbers, etc the state of their preparadness were gladly received from France.

    They and Italians even helped in the intelligence theatre with making sure no black market excoctes reached Argentina. And a major intelligence action involving William And Glyns bank and French agents was carried out to forestall any such purchasing.
     
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  10. PzJgr

    PzJgr Drill Instructor

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    Urgh has said it all on the Falklands issue. As for WWI. I don't agree that the British would have lost WWI but sure would not have won it without help. Remember, with the fall of the Czar, all of the German Eastern Armies were now moved to the West. It would have prolonged the stalemate. The American army tipped the balance. At best, the British and French could have won if revolution started in Germany. As in WWII, the victory in WWI was an allied victory.
     
  11. sommecourt

    sommecourt Member

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    I think 60,000 civilian dead, killed in aerial bombing, would disagree with that statement. :(
     
  12. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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    When talking off top on ones own head one should check self...Accension being the island I talk of. St Helena was last in my mind on another forum I was writing in a bit earlier about Napoleonic wars. Sorry.
     
  13. redfan45

    redfan45 Member

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    The German veterans dont get any respect, the last German ww1 veteran died and no one cared. WW2 vets die and noone cares over there, its sad.:(
     
  14. Skipper

    Skipper Kommodore

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    The problem is that we are probably all biased on the matter and will possibly all say that we respect the army. If we ask the question to the average person on the street, the answer may be completely different...
     
  15. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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  16. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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  17. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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  18. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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  19. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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  20. urqh

    urqh Tea drinking surrender monkey

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