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coldest weather?

Discussion in 'Military History' started by bronk7, Jan 3, 2015.

  1. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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  2. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    explode how?
     
  3. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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  4. Ken The Kanuck

    Ken The Kanuck Member

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  5. SKYLINEDRIVE

    SKYLINEDRIVE Member

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    Well that approach is dangerous as there is always a possibility of an extreme weather event. Just that happened in the winter of 1944/1945 on the Bulge battlefield, it was the harshest winter for centuries. Sure it wasn't Murmansk but still on many nights temperatures dropped to -17 degree Fahrenheit and some times even lower, which is not that far away from northern Scandinavia.
     
  6. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    -17 F at the Bulge?? that's not windchill? i didn't know it was that cold......
     
  7. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    When it is -10 degrees or less, and you don´t get hot meals daily or at all and your clothes are dirty all the time for more than a week, I bet it takes guts to be able to fight. Serving in the Finnish Army I noticed that the hot meals meant almost everything to your combat capability during two weeks in minus 30 degrees Celsius weather. And if your clothes get wet in that weather you´re as good as dead. Just my experience from the winter and army operations in the forest.
     
  8. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    ....I've never did training in cold weather....I wonder if there are any stats on temps per combat efficiency? the USMC was in subzero weather for about 17 days, and came out proud, undefeated....I'm sure the Finns, Germans, and Russians endured longer hell
     
  9. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Member

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    There should be stats...just not in the public domain. I saw a documentary many years ago about the USMC preparing to fight in Arctic conditions....over the oil in Antarctica if necessary ;)...and them carrying out tests on marines' efficiency in doing various tasks in subzero temperatures.

    Basically, they were chucking volunteers into a meat locker, covered in heat sensors, and monitoring body heat in various PARTS of the body as temps were brought down progressively...then asking them to field strip an M16! The length of time taken went UP exponentially as the outside temperature and internal body temperature dropped. Naturally!

    It was a VERY interesting programme. They were showing that once the temperature dropped and bloodflow into a marine's extremities dropped off....frostbite would set in. And t'bugger would STICK to the bits of the M16...

    So where was the non-circulating body fluids??? As the temperature plummeted, the sensors showed that it was all retained in the torso; it was an unconscious body reaction to extreme cold, the human body retained blood and body fluids in the torso to keep the vital organs THERE functioning ;)

    They went on to experiment with electrically-heated clothing and waistcoats. The same volunteers were put BACK into the meat locker...Again wearing just boxers!...but this time with an electrically heated waistcoat on ;) And the heat sensors showed that because the torso and its vital organs were FOOLED into thinking that the ambient temperature was "normal", they kept on circulating blood around the marine's naked extremities - no frostbite, and the marine was quite happy in his boxer shorts and waistcoat! And he didn't stick to metal parts of the M16 when asked to repeat the field strip!


    Some years later - when I was dispatching for a living - I invested in buying up a LARGE supply of thermal tshirts and longsleeved T's at the start of my first winter on the road. I layered up according to the forecast - a thermal tshirt, a normal tshirt, a thermal longsleeved tshirt and a fleece over it all....under a goretex jacket....and the keep -your-torso-warm trick worked! I was merrily riding around in near-zero temperatures in unlined leather gloves, an openfaced helmet and normal, summer-weight jeans...because my torso and vitals thought it was as warm as high summer! :)
     
  10. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    those lucky Leathernecks!! ..yes, doing simple jobs are harder in the cold..I walk/bike almost everyday to work....when it gets below 20, the bike doesn't want to work/everything seems heavier/etc....but I layer up and even in 5 F, I sometimes get a little overheated....just wearing goggles makes a big difference
     
  11. USMCPrice

    USMCPrice Idiot at Large

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    Didn't you get to do a rotation through Pickel Meadows when you were in the "Crotch"? The Marine Corps established their Mountain Warfare Training Center at Pickel Meadows in 1951 (though that wasn't the name at the time) to train Marines to fight in cold weather environments because of experience during the Chosin Reservoir Campaign in late November-December 1950. (Pickel Meadows is near Bridgeport, California). I went when I was stationed at LeJeune and we were working up for a NATO float. Great school. They've used it a lot during the current GWOT to get battalions prepared to operate in Afghanistan. When I was a young PFC in my first unit, there were still 6 or 7 senior enlisted and WO's that were Reservoir veterans and I heard quit a few sea stories about the practical problems involved with fighting in -37 degree weather. (Your dad and my uncle were both members of the "Chosin Few", but my uncle didn't talk nearly as much about it as the old salts in my first infantry battalion). How about how Col. Davis made the officers and men of his battalion give and repeat back orders several times because their minds were working so badly. How the wounded with really bad bleeds were placed outside because the blood would freeze and the bleeding would stop, when brought inside the bleeding would resume. They managed to save a bunch of Marines that would have bled to death waiting on the doctors being able to repair the wounds by doing these when the aid stations were overwhelmed. The squad that was so cold they went into an abandoned Korean hut and burned it down around themselves to get warm!
     
  12. bronk7

    bronk7 Well-Known Member

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    no. 55F in Hawaii was tough enough.....4 barracks, 4 in 3-6...went to Virginia-[ AP Hill,] 29 Palms where we used our hummers, so it was easy! no humping!, 6 months Med, two 6 months in UNITAS, about 3 weeks Hondo condo action Honduras-again no humping<>we did convoy duty, I guess cause we were mortars, and the 0311s had to do the real training<> which I learned my co-worker was at at same time..., a couple weeks off Columbia when the pres went there,...loved it<>moved a lot, never got boring....I put out a post on roll call, I think, my wife's uncle was with B 1-9!! Op Buffalo..I haven't read the book since the 90,s but I think B was point-walking dead...B was wiped out....he died 2 july 67..i remember my Dad's Chosin ''coat'' [?] I was a kid, and it was haevy!.. I had 3 bothers, and of course it got ''torn'' up or something...
     

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