Democracy - a good system?

And at least we don't fear an internal minority group so badly that we cower from radical Islam

I can just hope that you are not referring to France!(I know some media stated this).
There is indeed a large muslim minority in France, but this minority is rather well integrated and never had any political influence.(Not like the jewish lobby that actually has enormous influence in Washington).
And it was not France that actively and for years(till 2001) supported the Taliban regime in Afghanistan.(and build up Ben Laden)



while others do our fighting. I won't mention any specific countries.[/i][/quote]


Who does our fight in our place?
France is actively figthing islamic terrorists with troops in Djibouti and Afghanistan.(Altough it was not France that was attacked on 9/11).And there is also the possibility of french troops coming to Iraq, if the US finally decide to concede power to the UN.

 

Spied on? It was a lack of spying, domestically and abroad, that helped them accomplish 9/11.

Incorrect! The field operatives did their jobs, and did them quite well. The problem, which has been well published in various news papers, radio and T.V. is the fact that thier superiors did not follow through on the field reports regarding the 9-11 terrorost threat.

There has not been one shred of evidence, from a field operative, of weapons of mass destruction anywhere in Iraq. This was promised, promised by both the USA and British governments, yet has never been provided to the families of those asked to send their sons and daughters off to fight the terrorist foes of democracy.

The reports and claims came from the top officials of each of the two countries represented in my topic. If logic supports my view on what is real and what is not then knowing Iraq haas such weapons then someone, who is intelligent enough to realize what they are, has seen them PHYSICALLY! Right right!
Well since these weapons have yet to be found it is my educated guess that a field operative, friendly to either country, has never seen them.

Asking for proof, well tell you what you show me and the others, around the world, proof of their exsistence. Playing Possum with me doesn't work, it did once when I was around 6 years old and been around the block a few times,well enough to know and realize when someone is lying.like a carpet.

 

Oh please, the U.S. had complicated bits of information that, had they been pieced together properly, may have given enough clues to what was going to happen. Why weren't they pieced together? Because of Watergate era (mid 1970s) rules that prevented the CIA (the spies for the uninformed) from sharing info with the FBI, our federal internal criminal agency. We can thank a Senator named Frank Church for that.

And regarding chemical WMDs, I ask again, did they flush them down commodes like drug dealers fearing a raid? Or do you deny they were there in the Iran/Iraq war and 1991?

 

As you can see, 9/11 is a case of the ruling elite hearing only what they want to hear. Likewise, in Iraq the leaders of the USA and GB did not have sufficent evidence, yet they went ahead in attacking Iraq anyway. The same can be said for Vietnam - despite being vastly unpopular, the US did not withdraw until a new president was elected.

The leaders get what they want. Its just a question of extent.

 

I haven't seen any of this. Why?

Hmm, is this any better? I'm just making it clear that something can be said against your great personal freedoms.

You're saying that kids have no rights?? I am astonished, I might as well stay inside for a couple more years because anyone can come and take my food and my life, I have no rights for any of this.

The freedom to make this choice is forced upon them by a society with such tough demands that both parents have to work to stand up to them. Saying "some mothers" is not in accordance with my point here, by the way. Fathers can take care of kids perfectly.

Which country is that? The Netherlands have about 1500 soldiers in Iraq, out of an army of, maybe, 40,000. Most of these are keeping the peace in other areas as well, such as Afghanistan and Kosovo. Most of these areas are now in disorder and require military surveillance because certain countries (I won't mention any) went to war with them.

 

[/quote]

Thats a low blow. Its not anyone on the forums fault that thier country's leaders doesn't a 9/11 to happen to them.

 

First Socialism is not Communism.
Second here is an example of Socialism at work: Government grant monies.
Third these exsist in Canada, USA, Uk, France, Germany, Ireland.
George W. Bush applied for and recieved a goverment grant to help run one of his failed oil companies. Please see the reference postings in the Library Topic Section, "Fortunate Son".
By the way that application is a public record with the USA fedearl government, we all know how militant accountants can be when giving away any money, there is always a paper trail to record.

 

Socialism is government control of the means of production and distribution. Pure Communism does not exist and never could, so the all the fun is in getting there. After all, that's all Uncle Joe and Mao were trying to accomplish, to rid their societies of obstacles to the purity of Communism.

Socialism stagnates because there are no checks and balances. With private ownership there is a government to oversee. With Socialism there is no one to oversee. The only difference between Socialism as practiced today and Communism as practiced is how totalitarian the regime that controls everything.

By the way, Roel, the Netherlands is not one of the countries I was alluding to.

 

Castelot,
don't you think one of the reasons France and Germany didn't want to go to war w/Iraq is because of their large Muslim minority?

Also, there is a place in the Koran (Qu'ran) that does make jihad ligitamate for muslims. Now whether or not they hold to this, that is different. I believe most Muslims living in Europe or the U.S. do, but it is evident that most in the Mideast do. Hence the support for the Iraqi insurgents, 9/11 bombers, etc. over there. Thank you Alazeera News (notice sarcasm).

 

This is just crap Kklover.

If you don´t have even the most basic knowlegde about Islam, then I suggest that you stay away from the topic in the future. And racism is not tolerated on this forum.

 

What Skua means is that the Jihad is a victim of interpretation by fundamentalists. Originally this so-called 'sacred war' is the peaceful road the Muslem should take, according to the Koran, to help and lead others to the 'true' faith. Its goal is to make all people living in Muslem states Muslem themselves, and by free choice, only encouraged by loyal Islamic people performing Jihad. Never was this supposed to be a war against all non-Islamic countries.

 

KKlover, please read up on Islam before you wish to discuss it. The US (and to some extent Canada) have portrayed Jihad as killing your enemy by killing yourself, but it is far from, so I can see why you think the way you do, but as Roel mentioned, Jihad is taking the road of peace, which is much harder than taking the road of evil, Mohammed (prophet of Islam) following the first road.

I would like to know how you figure this.

 

No I don't think so.
As I already stated here french troops(and Germans too) are figthing islamic terrorists in many countries.
France joined the first gulf war.(1991)
There had so far not been any problem with the islamic minority.

Many countries that don't have a muslim minority also did not support this
war!

I already explained the reasons why most people here did not support that war:
- We were told this was about WMD, there were inspectors that told their inspections were working quite good, no WMD were found, but nevertheless, War came.90 % of european population(and a lot in the US too) just had the impression there were other reasons.

I am used to be lied upon by politicians(that's the same all over the world), but some statements made by american and british officials on Saddams's WMD were just unbelievable:

- Tony Blair" Saddam can attack England with his WMD in 45 minutes"
This was just so ridiculous.Saddams best missiles had a range of 160 km, to fire them on London, he would have had to bring them to Calais first.

Now, don't get me wrong, I like the USA very much(even if I don't have been there for more than 18 hours, hope to stay longer next time!).I had the pleasure to meet many americans and I think they are great people.
The only thing I do not like about the US is MC Donalds food. :-?

 

I agree entirely Castlelot. Excellent post!


I agree about McDonalds as well. (too bad we dont have a belching smily... perfect for right now. ) :-?

 

Jihads wouldn't be a problem, except for the extremist clerics declaring Jihads of death against Western Civilization in general. Hardly the road of peace in these particular cases.

 

This is the final straw! Lash out at our Democracy, criticize President Bush, attack Capitalism but please, please, please leave McDonalds out of this. Is nothing sacred on this post? :roll:

 

Read "Fast Food Nation," and then tell me how much you want to go to McDonald's.

 

Actually, Castelot mentioned this company as the only thing he didn't like about the US. You should look at it this way: he does like the rest of it!

By the way, McDonald's really bites.

 

I am afraid you got me wrong, I do not like the FOOD, I don't know anything about the company.

 

Not liking "Micky D's" (McDonalds) is a sin!

One of the best "fast food" places in America (for what that's worth)!

Actually, that is one of my biggest dislikes about the places I have been to overseas is that there are relatively few, sometimes no, fast food restaurants.

London and France has Micky D's but they just do not hold a candle to the ones here in the USA. Also, in ALexandria they have a "Pizza Hut". Worst pizza I ever had!

Cuisine I guess, is all about what one is used to.

:smok: