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Hedge Rows

Discussion in 'Western Europe 1943 - 1945' started by denny, Feb 19, 2015.

  1. toki2

    toki2 Active Member

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    There was a British government appeal during WW2 for recent holiday snaps of areas of German occupied Europe which would supplement aerial photographs.
     
  2. KJ Jr

    KJ Jr Well-Known Member

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    Looking at those pictures one can really get an "idea" of how cumbersome the bocage really was for offensive action.
     
  3. m kenny

    m kenny Member

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    It was never expected that the Allied would have to fight for any length of time that close to the beaches.
    The US sectors were very 'bocage' but most of the Commonwealth area was fairly open. The BLUECOAT area was more like the US bocage.
    First pic US sector. Second pic Commonwealth area.
     

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  4. Dave55

    Dave55 Member

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    Alright, alright! I'll pour myself a Calvados!
     
  5. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Be careful what you say there, Dave. I tried calvados while I in the area last September. That stuff will strip paint off of the wall.
     
  6. denny

    denny Member

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    Holy Cow.!
    Hundreds and Hundreds of French made booby-traps and fields of doom.
    2 machine guns, and a couple guys with a box of "tank-fists" roaming around.....they could have held-up, and played Hide And Seek with The Ally Army for days.
     
  7. Smiley 2.0

    Smiley 2.0 Smiles

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    Fighting in hedgerows kind of reminds me of urban fighting. You have to take each one, one at a time. There's not much you can do to except either blast your way through (which would take time if the core of the hedgerows was stone) or fight your way through. Especially since each one was practically occupied by the Germans and a fighting zone. Bombing may help somewhat,but I don't think it would have a major impact.
     
  8. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Member

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    I wonder...

    Given that the stone walls and ditches beneath the hedges were the area's particular type of field boundary/division...

    How much effort did it take for the French to repair the wartime damage done to them in the years following the war???
     
  9. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    The stones wouldn't have gone far, unless they were blown up. The hedges would be subject to routine wear-and-tear in peacetime, such as storm damage when a tree was uprooted, etc. So I'm sure they were familiar with the requirements for repairing them. The need wouldn't be pressing, France had a lot of things that needed fixing after the war.
     
  10. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Member

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    While that's certainly true...the area was far more livestock oriented then than now, it's gotten to be very arable. I remember reading personal account of 1944 that mentioned the all-pervading reek of rotting flesh in the weeks after D-Day because of all the slaughtered livestock bloating in the summer sun. I wonder how they dealt with re-closing the field enclosures - and all the unspent munitions laying around?

    We know all about mine clearance after the war...but somewhere like the Bocage there must have been a lot else too...
     
  11. Slipdigit

    Slipdigit Good Ol' Boy Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Phylo, that is one thing Mr. Sanford mentioned when we were talking about his book. He said in some areas it was so strong and you couldn't get away from it, as they were static and the dead cows were everywhere. He said it made it hard to eat their meals. They arranged a truce with Germans one afternoon to allow the locals to bury as many of the dead livestock as they could.

    He said that during the drive through the Falaise Gap, it was horrendous as the rotting flesh was combined with burning flesh over a large area.
     
  12. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Member

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    It could very well be!
     
  13. Sheldrake

    Sheldrake Member

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    That may be so with the advantage of hind sight. The infamous phase lines were just interpolations between d day and the D+90 target lodgement area. .
    http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/UN/Canada/CA/Victory/sk/Victory-4.jpg

    There is quite a lot of close country in France. The whole US sector is pretty much hedgerow country in the D - D+17 lines. The US advance West into Brittany would all have been through stone wall and hedgerow country. Although the area between caen and Falaise is open country, the area north east of Falaise and between the Dives and Seine is all woods and hedgerows.
     
  14. m kenny

    m kenny Member

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  15. denny

    denny Member

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    Maybe Naplam would have been a good weapon against the dug-in Germans of The Bocage.?
     
  16. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    You'd have to hit the right field, and from the right direction.
     
  17. phylo_roadking

    phylo_roadking Member

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    More likely handheld WP, like the WP grenades used for bunkers in the Pacific.
     
  18. denny

    denny Member

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    Isn't that true with any weapon.?
    You mark a map (these four fields here) and tell the pilots to burn it to the ground.
    Would it be different than ay other time Napalm was used.?
    Thank You
     
  19. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    No, but you point out that this is a problem for any weapon, and the reason that the fighting was so hard. One small walled hard point after another. The Germans would have fallen back just before they were overrun and the Allies would have to attack the next one all over again. The Culin cutters allowed the tanks to strike at several points at once and disrupt enemy withdrawal with cross-fires.
     
  20. OpanaPointer

    OpanaPointer I Point at Opana Staff Member WW2|ORG Editor

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    Just read in Roosevelt's Centurions the Marshall told an interviewer that intelligence hadn't told them about the hedgerows until it was too late. (He also told the interviewer not to print that.)
     

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