Most over rated general of the war?

I think that MacArthur's tactics for moving up the coast of New Guinea was called "hit 'em where they ain't." It called for by-passing strongholds, isolating and neutralizing them before continuing on and establishing airbases and points of re-supply.

The "island hopping" moniker and tactic was Nimitz's contribution. Seizing islands that were strategically important, provided safe anchorages, and neutralizing Japanese strongholds that threatened lines of advance, supply and communications.

In keeping with the theme of the thread, I believe that MacArthur was severely overrated. He completely bungled and single-handedly saw to the collapse of US resistance in the Philippines by his inaction in training up the Philippine Army properly (and that he led Washington to believe that he was doing the opposite). After Pearl Harbor, he drug his feet and failed to enact his own war plans (WPO) immediately, then went to oppose Japanese landings at the Lingayen Gulf half-heartedly, then quickly called WPO into play and moved the army to Bataan, while leaving tons and tons of war supplies in Manila and Cavite. No, this wouldn't have saved the US-Philippine troops in 1942 from defeat. The brave defenders still had "no momma, no pappa, no Uncle Sam," but they would have been able to hold out longer and more efficiently, keeping Japanese troops occupied there that could have been employed elsewhere.

 

A58;
Doug put in a pretty uneven performance at times; MacArthur and Defeat in the Philippines. - book review | Naval War College Review | Find Articles at BNET
And as I understand a lot of his men absolutely hated him Still his island hopping savvy and rule as "The American Shogun of Japan" deserve the respect of the American people. Controversial to be sure and the man should have stayed out of politics. Korea? Well that is out of the scope of this forum.
JeffinMNUSA

 

+1.

I think Nimitz was underrated along with Halsey

 

Just about any general or admiral that someone dislikes or feels that was under/overrated for any reason will have his good days along with the bad ones. I still stand firm abut McArthur. Yes, his "hit 'em where they ain't" strategy save many lives, but it was after getting several bloody noses in New Guinea that cost a lot of Australian and US casualties before he developed alternative tactics. His insistance of having his right flank secure by invading Peleliu cost many lives and definitely not needed. The airfield there could have been pounded into useless rubble and neutralized without putting boots on the ground there. I do agree with his insistance on re-taking the Philippines, then going onto Okinawa plan over Nimitz's by-passing the PI and taking Taiwan in preparation for an invasion of the mainland of China. Taiwan is and was extrememely populated, and many un-neccessay casualties, both military and civilian would have occurred. As for the folly of getting tied down in a major land war in Asia, the casualties there would have been enormous, and would have delayed the invasion of Okinawa and the Japanese Mainland for years. Keep in mind that the generals and admirals had no knowledge of the coming atomic bombs. There were high civilian losses in the re-capturing of the Philippines, but they suffered enormously under Japanese occupation, as did the POWs that were still alive.

And Mac's Shogun Days were post-WW2, so even though he did a good job in that capacity, I'm sure we could have come up with an effective alternative. Even if his Emperial Period and his Inchon offensive would be considered, his failure to accept the fact that the Chicoms were massing at the border above the Yalu, and were already sparring with advanced UN units and his disgusting handling of the Bonus Army in the 1930s would counter the bright spots mentioned.

To me, the most reprehensible act was his ordering General Wainwright to hold out to the last man and go down fighting like the men at the Alamo just before his hopping on Lt. Bulkley's torpedo boat enroute to Australia via Mindinao. And FDR gave him the Medal of Honor for his exploits, while he tried to deny Wainwright his at the same time. The egotistical self-centered SOB should rot in hell....Figuratively speaking of course....

Whew, glad I got that out of the way....All better now!

 

QFT

 

Hitler gave Himmler an Army group to lead a couple of times. Not a very good result surprisingly.

 

What an origional plan,
I'm glad macarthur is being discussed because i think its much better having people talk things than just looking up achievements etc in some almenac.

 

It really depends on "overrated by whom" Although it is typically assumed to be "overrated by people today" it is also interesting to discus which generals were most overrated by supreme commanders or most overrated by the enemy.

 

Is that good or bad?

 

Rommel? Perhaps in the sense that your average joe might associate him with German tanks.

But in books; you will find that people are generous to him but by no means overrated. I would say that he is easily that of Germany's most respected men. With good reason as well, he was probably the most liked in Germany as well as the morale boost that would have been received by his soldiers.

Among the underrated I would say, Erich Manstein,George Marshall, Zhukov, Hermann Hoth, Paul Hausser and Guderian.



Did anybody ever consider that Monty might be a tad overrated because he is what... the ONLY British General that North American media knows about?

 

It seems to me that the reason why these generals (id est, Patton, Rommel, Montgomery) might be "overrated" by people today is that those are the major generals typically focused on in history text books. Therefore people read these books and if they don't study WWII further, then those are the generals they think are the best because they are the only ones they know. The average person doesn't know who Paul Hausser is, or Hermann Hoth. Another nice example of media censoring shaping our lives

 

Montgemory Had defeated Rommel in El El Alamein Battle (Yeah I know that Monty's Forces&Supplies Were Superior 2-3 X of Rommel's ,nevertheless He could defeat The Desert Fox.Erwin Rommel Who was a great Strategic Leader of course ,eventhough his low Forces & Supplies!!)
Both are great Generals!!

 

I also would think that when your average documentary refers to every Person in Germany as "The Nazis" Herr Rommel might be perceived as the "underdog" which might spawn more sympathy for him.

 

Good point, but I believe after 1943 no matter who was the commander of Soviet Army; the Russians would have taken Berlin. Zhukov put more Russian soldiers in the ground than was necessary. I also believe he got credit for his subordinates command decisions.

 

Isnt Formosa the same island called Taiwan today? Assuming you were right (which you very well might be), wouldnt that have been an interesting place for American troops to be in 1950?!

 

Nimitz originally wanted to take Formosa. MacArthur would not hear of it. Philippines or nothing as far as he was concerned.

 

When i said it was an origional plan i was being a tad sarcastic,thats exactly the plan the japanese worked with the burma road.

Its hard to argue zhukov,the guy supposedly never lost a battle.

 

I don't think Zhukov is overrated, but he did loose. Look into Operations Mars, one of his biggest defeats:

Operation Mars - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Zhukov was (arguably) the best that Russia had. Thanks to this man cities such as Leningrad and Moscow did not fall, the Red Army learned how to win and under his command soldiers suffered less casualties in comparison to any other Soviet general. Not to mention that he won virtually every battle against the best German commanders and captured Berlin.

Not sure I would count him over rated.

 

IMO..Montgomery was a poor General. He had success's especially in North Africa, however I always thought he had a vendetta against Patton and it was much deeper than a "rivalry". His persistence of going forward with "Market Garden" is a prime example. His vanity and willingness to "one up" Patton cost the allies. He shrugged off all Intel showing the German strengths, he ignored other commanders when they said Market Garden was a negative, risk reward scenario. Montgomery used political pressure to get "His" operation and then conveniently blamed the allied field commanders when they were unable to succeed. His intentions were to get a German surrender by Christmas and it actually increased German resolve and morale and lengthened the war by 4-5 months.