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Outline of Operation Jubilee: The Raid on Dieppe, 19 August 1942

Discussion in 'Western Europe 1939 - 1942' started by Mahross, Oct 1, 2004.

  1. Mahross

    Mahross Ace

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    Sinclair - I agree with you. There is a lot of atention paid to the operation but the same can be said of Gallipoli for Austrialians. Its one of those things when an operation involving a small nation goes wrong and causes casualties it has a tendency to produce an outpouring of writing. It is interesting to note that during the war C P Stacey wrote Historical reports for the Canadian Military HQ and in all produced about 120 of them. Out of that about 15 are devoted to certain aspects of the Dieppe operation. That makes about 10% quite a lot when you think that this is 9 hour operation out of canad's 6 years of war.
     
  2. Maverik

    Maverik Member

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    Hi I know very little about Dieppe and was interested to realise how many Canadians were involved.

    Can someone tell me why Canadians were selected for this assignement and who would have selected them?
     
  3. Mahross

    Mahross Ace

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    Maverik - Out of the approximate 6000 troops involved there were 5000 Canadians. There were 2 brigades from the 2nd Infantry Div and the 14th Canadian Tank Battalion.

    As to why they were used is slightly more complex but put simple the canadian had come to the aid of britain in 1939 and since then ad seen no action and there was a wish to see them do something. There was also at this time a decided policy shift in canada. since 1940 they had wanted to sit back and wait until they could deploy significant forces to continent along with british forces but then in 1942 they started to push for a second front along with the americans. so the major problem that occured in 1942 was that the candians were trying to get there forces to see action thus when Rutter, the original pan for Dieppe, was being planned McNaughton, commander of candian forces in britian. readily agreed that the 2nd division could be used.

    This is iyt in a nutshell but for more i suggest you read the chapter 'How Canada became Involved' in Brian Loring Villa's 'Unauthorised Action'.
     
  4. TheRedBaron

    TheRedBaron Ace

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    Their is another aspect to it..

    The British were also keen to use the Canadians as heavy losses on home troops would have had a poor effect on morale on the home front. Far better to make widows on the other side of the Atlantic than at home...

    I feel that had a small part to play in the decision.

    I always liked Lord Haw Haw's comments on the Canadian troops...
     
  5. Maverik

    Maverik Member

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    Hi Mahross,

    Thats great just interested to know, I thought it might have to do with lack of British troops available.

    But what your saying is that the Canadians broke one of the fundamental military rules:.......Never Volunteer!
     
  6. Martin Bull

    Martin Bull Acting Wg. Cdr

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    I came across a secondhand copy of Brian Loring Villa's book 'Unauthorised Action' in London today and thanks to Mahross' recommendation in this thread, immediately bought it ( I'd never heard of it before ).

    I've long wanted to read more about the why's and wherefore's of Dieppe but don't have time or inclination to read everything that has been written.

    I like the tone of the introduction and I'm looking forward to reading the book.....
     
  7. Mahross

    Mahross Ace

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    Great buy Martin. Like i said a very good read even if i don't agree with much of his arguement.
     
  8. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    Read Neillands book on Dieppe.

    Just wondered about this: Did several tanks make it to the promenade from the beach? The author says that although the shingle beach broke many tanksĀ“ tracks some ten tanks did make it to the promenade, but after that they could not make it as there were tank obstacles everywhere, and the sappers to blow them were all dead on the beaches. Finally the ten tanks returned to the beach but still, it was possible to get off the beach?
     
  9. macrusk

    macrusk Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

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    Other information on Dieppe:

    From "The History of The Third Canadian Light Anti-Aircarft Regiment" My father was a member of the 16th Battery. He would have been there except the "misfortune" of being injured by a parachute bomb while on dispatch duty riding a motorcycle in England in Apr 1942. He recovered against all odds to serve through NW Europe, but never stopped feeling guilty for not being with his mates.

    "Operation 'Jubilee' took place in the month of August. A force made up of Headquarters 2nd Canadian Infantry Division, 4th and 6th Canadian Infantry Brigades and detachements from other arms and services plus commandos and a party from Royal Marine Commandos supported by the Royal Navy and Royal Air Force, landed on seven beaches in the Dieppe area, France, at 0528 hours on the 19th August, 1942, after crossing the channel without loss.

    The 3rd Canadian Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment sent 10 Officers and 236 Other Ranks, who were allotted different tasks, in support of Infantry battalions. For this operation the personnel were divided into five parties.

    The task of the first party was to provide anti-aircraft protection on the beach. It was made up of 3 Officers, namely: Major C.R. Ostrander, Officer Commanding Anti-Aircraft Group, Captain P.T. Rowe, Capatin A. Perley-Roberson, and 49 other ranks from the 16th Battery. They embarked on a Tank Landing Craft along with personnel from the Toronto Scottish Regiment on the 18th August, 1942, and proceeded to France. The night was spent in cleaning light machine guns and loading magazines, as well as instructing the light anti-aircraft personnnel in the handling of hand grenades and 100 round Bren magazines. By 0630 hours the Eastern German coastal Battery had not been taken by the Commandos. Major Ostrander was then informed that the craft would touch down in 15 minutes but it stopped one mile off-shore and was sent to a navy pool with seven others. Until 1200 hours fighting was going on in the town and in the air, with the destroyers constantly firing inland. The anti-aircraft gunners had a chance to engage a few enemy aircraft, and along with Oerlikons manned by Navel personnel and Vickers machine guns manned by The Toronto Scottish, one Focke Wolfe 190 was destroyed and another damaged. At 1200 hours orders were received to return to England. The party had no casualties.

    The second party's task was to capture an anti-aircraft gun in order to investigate a new type of gun sight that the Germans were using. This party was composed of 2 Officers and 24 Other Ranks from the 16th Battery. They embarked with the Royal Regiment of Canada, to whom they were attached. When the craft landed, the beach was strewn with bodies in and out of the water and up the seawall. It was continuously swept by machine gun as well as sniper fire and the men that reached the wall were treated with hand grenades dropped from the cliff above and with mortar fire. At approximately 1100 hours the craft was ordered to return. Of this party only seven Other Ranks returned - Lieutenant F.B. Carpenter, Lieutenant J.D. McFetridge and the seventeen Other Ranks were reported missing.

    The third party which was composed of 1 Sergeant and 6 Other Ranks from the 16th Battery was on special duty with Captain Harrel of the British Intelligence Service. They did not land and returned without casulaties.

    The fourth party, composed of 3 Officers, Captain G.C. Wallach, Lieutenant S.A. Bourns, Lieutenant J.R.C. Dowdell and 54 Other Ranks from the 17th Battery was under command of Lieutenant-Colonel Gosling, the Commanding Officer of the Toronto Scottish Regiment. It was allotted the task of forming 5 anti-aircraft detachments of 4 Bren guns each, which were to be inside the perimeter of the Toronto Scottish Vickers machine guns in order to protect the pavilion on the beach from aircraft attacks.

    The craft arrived off the coast at 0645, where it remained for six hours. Anti-aircraft protection was provided by two twenty millimeter guns manned by Naval personnel and eight Vickers lifth machine guns manned by the Toronto Scottish Regiment. Our personnel did not set up the Bren guns, as it was necessary to keep the ammunition for their task. At approximately 1200 hours, the craft was ordered to return to England, withough having landed, as another Tank Landing Craft which had landed at their point of disembarkation had been sunk by a German Coastal Battery. No casualties were suffered by this party.

    The fifth party consisted of 1 Officer, Lieutenant J.R.Ferguson, and 51 Other Ranks from the 53rd Battery and 1 Officer, Captain Nobleston, and 41 Other Ranks from the 38th Battery. The task allotted was first to provide anti-aircraft protection for the Tank Landing Crafts and secondly to help in unloading tanks. The party was divided into two Battery groups and embarked on two Tank Landing Craft with Calgary Tank Regiment. They were given 25 Bren gunss and 125,000 rounds of ammunition per craft.

    The crafts were scheduled to land at 0700 hours but did not. Throughout the morning the gunners were busily engaged in firing at enemy aircraft. At noon, they returned to England without loss...

    ...On the 23rd August a large representation of all ranks attended a Memorial Service at Brookwood for those who made the supreme sacrifice at Dieppe."

    Michelle
     
  10. macrusk

    macrusk Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

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    Part 1 From "The Gunners of Canada" Colonel G.W.L. Nicholson, C.D.

    "...16 officers and 256 other ranks represented the Royal Canadian Artillery in the force of nearly 5,000 Canadian solders that embarked at five ports in Southern England for the cross-Channel raid on Dieppe. Of that force, less than one half would return to England on the completion of the operation. The total of 3,267 fatal and non-fatal casulaties would include 48 Canadian artillerymen....account will deal only with the part played by the Canadian gunners in the operation.

    The object of the raid was to destroy enemy defences in the vicinity of Dieppe, together with aerodrome installations and radar and power stations, dock and rail facilities and petrol dumps; and to seize secret enemy documents, capture prisoners, and remove invasion barges for Allied use....The military force consisted of Headquarters 2nd Canadian Division, the 4th and 6th Infantry Brigades, the 14th Canadian Army Tank Regiment (The Calgary Regiment), and detachments from other infantry units and from other arms and services, together with British Commando trooops. The artillery component was made up of 10 officers and 236 other ranks of the 3rd Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment R.C.A., an officer from each of the 2nd Division's three field regiments to serve with infanty batallions as Forward Observation Officers for naval guns, and a detachment of two officers and 20 gunners from the 4th Field Regiment to man captured enemy guns. In addition, the 7th Anti-Tank Regiment had an officer serving as Liaison officer with H.Q. 4th Brigade. The entire military force was under the command of a distinguished gunner officer, Maj.-Gen. J. Hamilton Roberts, who in April of that year had become G.O.C. 2nd Division after serving for nine months as C.C.R.A. 1st Canadian Corps.

    Three months before Operation 'Jubilee' was mounted, the light anti-aircraft regiment and detachments from the field regiments had formed part of the force that assembled in the Isle of Wight for specialized training under Headquartes 2nd Canadian Division. The three officers designated for F.O.O. duties were sent off to Scotland, where a special course was arranged for them at the Combined Operation Training Centre. At that time the cross-Channel raid was scheduled for 4 July, but unsuitable weather brought a cancellation. The force was broken up, and the disappointed troops returned to their various roles on the English mainland. When the venture was revived, senior officers of the units involved were informed only a few days before it took place.

    Darkness was falling on the evening of 18 August as the various components of the raiding forces began crossing the Channel, carried in infanty landing craft of various kinds. Members of the 3rd L.A.A. Regiment embarked five separate parties, according to as many tasks as were allotted to Lt.-Col. Ker's unit. The gunners took none of their Bofors with them; their fighting would be done with Bren guns, small arms, and grenades.

    Three officers and 49 other ranks from the 16th Battery were aboard a tank landing craft with personnel from the Toronto Scottish Regiment....Shortly after midday on the 19th came the order to with draw. The A.A. gunners had suffered no casualties.

    Similarly unable to land on the French beaches, and returning to England without loss, were the three parties drawn from the 16th, 17th and 28th Batteries. These had been assigned the tasks of providing, with the Toronto Scottish, anti-aircraft defence of the Dieppe Casino; protecting from air attack the tank landing craft carrying the Calgary Regiment, as well as helping unload tanks; and for a small group of seven men of the 16th Battery, a special duty with a British intelligence officer.

    The assignment given to Colonel Ker's remaining party, comprising two officers and 24 other ranks of the 16th Battery, was to get possession of a certain model of enemy anti-aircraft gun for the purpose of investigatinig a new type of sight which Intelligence reported the Germans to be using. The group embarked with The Royal Regiment of Canada, which was to make a landing on Blue Beach, at Puys, just east of Dieppe. As the result of a mix-up in the landing arrangements, assault craft beached more than half an hour late, a delay which cost the attackers the protection of darkness and a smoke screen laid down by the navy. The defenders of Blue Beach opened fire while the leading craft carrying the infantry were still offshore. Casualties were heavy. The Forward Observation Officer with the Royals was Captain G.A. Browne, of the 4th Field, who thus described the Batallion's reception: 'In five minutes' time they were changed from an assaulting Batallion into something less than two companies on the defensive, being hammered by fire which they could not locate.'

    By the time the craft bearing the anti-aircraft gunners touched down, the beach was strewn with bodies in and out of the water and all the way to the ten-foot-high sea wall. The party scrambled ashore in the face of a hail of machine-gun and mortar fire and sought refuge in the dubious shelter of the wall, where hand grenades were dropped on them by the defenders on the cliffs above. 'The episode at Puys,'declares the Official History , 'was the grimmest of the whole grim operation.' Of the 554 of The Royal Regiment who had sailed from England, 227 were killed or fatally wounded. Among the small handful of Canadians who were evacuated from Blue Beach were seven men of the 3rd L.A.A. Regiment. Lt. F.B. Carpenter and eight of his men had been killed. The other officer, Lt. M.C. McFetridge, who had been wounded, and the remaining nine other ranks, were all taken prisoner.

    The field gunners taking part in 'Jubilee' ran into trouble from the start. Capt.W.J. McCutcheon, 7th Field Regiment, was killed while landing with the Queen's Own Cameron Highlanders of Canada on Green Beach at Pourville. The party from the 4th Field landed with The Royal Regiment on Blue Beach. But the special training which they had taken on the handling of German guns was not to be tested at this time. A battery of howitzers that was to have been turned against the defenders remained uncaptured by the infantry. None of the party got back to England at the end of the battle. Three gunners were killed; and the remaining 17 and their two officers wer forced to surrender.

    continued in next post
     
  11. macrusk

    macrusk Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

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    Part 2 from "The Gunners of Canada"

    "The other two Forward Observation Officers survived, each being decorated for his part in the operation. Capatin H.B. Carswell, of the 6th Field, was wounded as he landed with the first wave of the South Saskatchewan Regiment on Green Beach. For eight hours he remained on the beach observing fire from teh destroyers and from such mortars as he could organize. Though wounded a second time, he did valuable work in helping to organize the collection of casualties for the withdrawal. He was awarded the Military Cross - the first to be won by a Canadian gunner officer in the Second World War.

    In the fireswept area in front of Puys, Cpatin Browne's wireless set was the only one that was working on Blue Beach. From his vulnerable position at teh foot of the cliff Browne maintained communications throughout the morning hours with a destroyer offshore. Then, like the bulk of the Canadians who escaped death on that blood-soaked beach, he was forced to surrender. About three weeks later the Adjutant of the 4th Field Regiment was amazed to receive from him a cable which had been sent from Lyons, saying that he was held prisoner at Fort de la Duchere. The sequel was equally surprising. In January 1943, two officers of the 4th Field, on leave in London, bumped into Captain Browne at teh bar of the Park Lane Hotel. He was extremely reticent about how he came to be there, and they were careful not to press him. Later it was learned that members of teh French underground movement had helped him to escape, and that he had brought back valuable information about the enemy's defence system in France...

    The amphibious assualt at Dieppe taught many lessons. One was 'the need for overwhelming fire support' of the landings. This would result not only in a tremendous increase in the naval and air bombardment for the invasion of Normandy in 1944. When the assaulting troops went ashore on D Day, helping to clear their path would be self-propelled artillery, firing initially from tank landing craft during the run in, and then continuing their support from positions on land during the early pashes of the attack."

    Information from a couple of sources that had not been previously cited. There is another series of books written from the artillery perspective by George Blackburn of the 4th Field Regiment, and he includes information on Dieppe, including the shackling of the Canadian troops for a large percentage of their time as POWs.

    Michelle
     
  12. macrusk

    macrusk Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

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    Just read this article today. I don't have my Dad's full military records yet - just cursory dates from a limited access version. He was injured in April 1942, but as mentioned in previous posts on this thread he was a member of the 16th Battery 3LAA that took part in the Dieppe Raid. The article from 2004 is throwing me off because prior to my Dad dying in 1996 - probably the summer of 1991 - he told me about being a bodyguard for a raid in France for a radar expert and that if it looked like the expert was to be captured then they were ordered to kill him. I've mentioned on other threads that he told me very little of his actual service and then only at a couple of specific points in my life. So I find it intriguing to read this story that confirms exactly what he said, and yet he was not on the raid as he was only discharged from hospital a couple of days prior to the Dieppe Raid and he did not have the Dieppe Bar on his medals. He was not inclined to tell be a story teller about himself, so I find it unlikely that he claimed something that he did not do. It will be very frustrating if I am unable to see his full records before 2016!

    Michelle
     
  13. 4th wilts

    4th wilts Member

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    do not forget,the same division and regts,were given the honour of liberating dieppe,along with aircraft from the r.c.a.f.i have another family,as it were,with my grandads 2 sisters both marrying canadian soldiers,one from ontario and another from toronto.alas,i do not know many family members,but they probably dont know of me,and who can blame them.lee.
     
  14. afcbob

    afcbob recruit

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    Michelle:
    my dad Archie Sudbury is the president of the 16th LAA Battery Association, he served from start of the war with them and the 38th after D-Day to end of war. Battery still has yearly meeting in Vancouver. If you need any help in history let me know, I'm the historian for them. What was your dad's name for my information.
    Bob Sudbury
     
  15. macrusk

    macrusk Proud Daughter of a Canadian WWII Veteran

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    Hi Bob, I am so excited to see your post!!! My Dad was Chamberlain "Lloyd" Cochrane K16121. He was 15th (Van) Coastal Brigade (Militia NPAM90880 mobilized August 24 1939. Effective 23 Oct 1939 posted 58th Heavy Battery RCA Vancouver. Reposted to 16th LT AA Battery Sept 9, 1940. September 13 1944 he was attached to 2CI Div HQ RCA.

    I would love to have every tiny bit of history you can give me about the 16th LAA Battery. I am actually writing a book about my parents, so anything you can share with me would be a help. Please do let me know when they have their yearly meeting. My avatar shows my parent's wedding photo. I will attach a photo of my Dad during the War Years.

    You may be interested in the transcription I have slowly been adding to the Forum of the History of the Third Canadian Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment.

    My apologies for the delay in responding, I have been out of the country since Aug 15 and only returned today. I so look forward to hearing from you.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. Jonathan Rush

    Jonathan Rush New Member

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    For a book I am writing, I am researching the participation and role of the British Special Operations Executive (SOE) in the 16th Battery, 3rd Canadian Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment during Operation Jubilee at Dieppe Some of the SOE agents were disguised as Canadian Army officers, For example, Anglo Frenchman, 'Captain' Edouard (Teddy) Bisset. Aided by six soldiers and a sergeant from the Canadian regiment, Bisset and fellow SOE agents' task was to search the Town Hall and carry out a special mission (possibly to pinch an Enigma coding machine). I have a photo showing Teddy Bisset at Operation Jubilee dressed as a Canadian Army captain. Unfortunately it is too large to upload here. I'd be happy to email it to anyone if it helps. The SOE team spent five hours in a landing craft, within hailing distance of the shore but never landed. I would be very grateful if someone could point me in the direction where I might be able to find some more information. One question I have is: would the Canadian Army soldiers have been French speaking?
     
  17. Kai-Petri

    Kai-Petri Kenraali

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    After years of reading books I think that one key element was that the tanks could not leave the beach due to the pebbles and German tank obstacles. I know this is not the only problem but if the tanks had reached their objects it might have been a different case of the Dieppe battle in fighting to get the troops further to the city and not only " Churchill's example to Stalin" that the invasion was impossible. Just my thought that perhaps the shore was not checked enough for the tanks??
     
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  18. Carronade

    Carronade Ace

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    That does seem odd; Dieppe was a popular tourist destination, you'd think they could find someone knowledgeable about the beach - not to mention the Free French. Maybe a bit of the "tanks can go anywhere" philosophy? The Churchill was generally pretty effective on rough terrain.

    Prior to D-Day in 1944, frogmen snuck ashore and brought back samples of beach sand, maybe one of the "lessons learned" from Dieppe.
     
  19. Dennis Alexander Kalnoky

    Dennis Alexander Kalnoky Member

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    Great thread, I have enjoyed reading
     
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  20. Takao

    Takao Ace

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    The shore had been checked as much as could be.
    Only 4 tanks were immobilized by chert without leaving the beach. Although another 4 tanks were immobilized by chert after returning to the beach following the withdrawal order.

    Further, a device was engineered to allow the Churchill tanks to proceed over the chert. However, in the heat of battle, mistakes were made using this device.

    Not to mention that the guns were mostly ineffective against dug-in troops. Some Churchill tanks mounted a 2-pounder(40 mm), while others mounted the 6-pounder(57 mm). 3 Ch<r child's were fitted with flamethrower.

    The Germans had constructed formidable anti-tank obstacles which prevented the tanks from advancing into the town. The sappers, which were to destroy these obstacles took heavy casualties as the German defense was intense.

    So, I would have to say no, the tanks would not have materially affected the battle had more made it off the beach.
     
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